From Boeing China Strategist to CBD & Beverage Brand Builder: How He Did it!

📢I talk🎙️with Thomas Angel Co-Founder of Altitude Beverages in Bend, Oregon. 👏🍷 🎇 🎉 ✨ 👏 🥂  😁

NOW ON YOUTUBE! 📽 🎞 
https://youtu.be/cWkac6fkdHs

[Originally Posted on April 5th, 2023.]

Thomas and his wife started Altitude Beverage because they wanted to create a coffee alternative for those that are in the CBD and Better-for-you beverage space. Their coffee alternative drinks are all Nitro cocktails that you actually shake before opening. They are smooth beverages mixed with Oatmilk, my favorite, 30mg of CBD, and Adaptogens which assist you in getting your day started. These are feel-good ingredients like Lion’s Mane for FOCUS, Chaga for immunity, and Reishi for gut health just to name a few. 

 They didn’t stop there. Next was all about the afternoon happy hour time you spend with your loved ones discussing your day. They were wanting a non-alcoholic option that helped you wind down. So, just like getting your day started, they wanted to help you wind down just the same. 

 They created three very different mocktails that have 20mg of CBD and are all based with white tea and a few bubbles. These adaptogens are for a nice recovery to the end of your day with Gaba, for calm, L-Thianine for relaxation and 5-HTP for serotonin.

 Thomas had a very unusual journey into the beverage space and his story is one of kind. I don’t know a lot of Americans that speak Chinese, let alone one that ended up working for the President of Boeing living in Beijing, China. He tells his journey working at Boeing for 10 years and why he and his wife started Altitude Beverages.

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Chapters

• 2:00 Welcome
• 2:15 Where Thomas is Calling in From
• 6:53 Where Thomas is From
• 9:28 How his Career Started at Boeing
• 23:07 How COVID-19 Pivoted His Career
• 28:05 Process to be an entrepreneur
• 29:09 Major Turning Point on Functional Ingredients
• 36:19 Phase II Ideation
• 36:58 1st Tasting - Nitro Cold Brew
• 38:03 The Name
• 41:12 His Amazing Wife
• 41:51 Wanted to start a business together
• 42:13 Thomas worked for the President of Boeing China
• 45:22 1st Drink Ingredients
• 52:33 Cold Brew as the base ingredient in the lattes
• 54:18 1st Productiom in May in market in June
• 54:49 2nd Tasting Chai Latte
• 56:52 1st Big Customer
• 59:28 Distribution Model
• 1:00:21 Sprouts Sample Request was game changer for 2022
• 1:03:30 3rd Tasting Macha Latte
• 1:08:03 Moving on to the Happy Hour line
• 1:11:28 Tasting the Blue Hawaiian
• 1:14:37 How to serve these drinks
• 1:17:37 The Why in Non-Alc Movement
• 1:20:36 The Relaxation Element
• 1:23:41 HH Drink #2 Paloma
• 1:28:12 3rd and Final HH Cocktail Mountain Mule
• 1:31:28 Customer Feedback
• 1:32:23 Goal of creating an experience
• 1:32:43 Where you can buy them
• 1:35:29 Online Marketing
• 1:37:42 One thing no one knows about Thomas
• 1:39:03 Thomas's favorite movie
• 1:42:47 Produced by Fedora J Productions

Transcript

00:00:10:00 - 00:00:36:13
Jessie Ott
Welcome to Thursday, Thursdays at 3 p.m. Eastern Standard Time. My name is Jessica. The host of this podcast, which is all about beverage innovation. I talk with innovation pioneers from agriculture to glass. This week I spoke with Thomas Angel, co-founder of Altitude Beverages in Bend, Oregon. Thomas and his wife started Altitude Beverages because they wanted to create a coffee alternative for those that are in the CBD and better for you.

00:00:36:13 - 00:01:00:00
Jessie Ott
Beverage space. Their coffee alternative drinks are all nitro cocktails that you actually shake before opening. They are smooth beverages mixed with oatmilk, my favorite 30mg of CBD and adaptogens, which assist you in getting your day started. These are feel good ingredients like lion's mane for focus, chaga for immunity, and reishi for gut health, just to name a few.

00:01:00:02 - 00:01:25:00
Jessie Ott
They didn't stop there. Next was all about the afternoon happy hour time you spend with your loved ones, discussing your day. They were wanting a nonalcoholic option that helps you wind down. So just like getting your day started, they wanted to help you wind down just the same. They created three very different mocktails that have 20mg of CBD in, and are all based with white tea and a few bubbles.

00:01:25:02 - 00:01:49:15
Jessie Ott
These adaptogens are for a nice recovery to the end of your day with Gaba for calm, l-theanine for relaxation, and five HTP for serotonin. Thomas had a very unusual journey into the beverage space, and his story is one of a kind. I don't know a lot of Americans that speak Chinese, let alone one that would end up working for the president of Boeing living in Beijing, China.

00:01:49:17 - 00:02:12:09
Jessie Ott
He tells his journey working for Boeing for over ten years, and why he and his wife started Altitude Beverages. Thank you for listening and be sure to subscribe to be notified of all new episodes. Welcome to Thursday, Thursday at 3 p.m. Eastern Standard Time. My name is Jesse at and I have an exciting guest this week. Thomas Angel, how are you doing, Thomas?

00:02:12:11 - 00:02:14:15
Thomas Angel
I'm doing well. Thank you for having me. Jesse.

00:02:14:17 - 00:02:16:13
Jessie Ott
Where are you calling from today?

00:02:16:15 - 00:02:25:23
Thomas Angel
Today I'm actually in Issaquah, Washington. We're on the road right now. But, normally based in bend, sorry. Bend, Oregon.

00:02:26:01 - 00:02:30:07
Jessie Ott
Bend, Oregon. And you said that was how many, elevation. How many feet.

00:02:30:09 - 00:02:31:14
Thomas Angel
Were.

00:02:31:16 - 00:02:38:01
Thomas Angel
Almost 4000ft. Yeah. Up in the, up in the mountains of, of central Oregon.

00:02:38:02 - 00:02:44:03
Jessie Ott
Nice. Okay. So how is that in terms of, like, the Willamette Valley and.

00:02:44:05 - 00:03:06:20
Thomas Angel
Yeah. Yeah. So here in the Pacific Northwest, we have the Cascade Mountain Range that kind of bisects, both Washington and Oregon. So, like where I'm at here on the the west side of the Cascades in sort of the Seattle area, it's very similar to West Side, of Oregon. It's very temperate weather, you know, kind of notoriously gray and rainy.

00:03:06:22 - 00:03:08:06
Thomas Angel
Whereas,

00:03:08:08 - 00:03:11:00
Thomas Angel
In here.

00:03:11:02 - 00:03:14:10
Thomas Angel
Yeah, actually, yeah, it is that wet. Cold.

00:03:14:12 - 00:03:15:02
Thomas Angel


00:03:15:04 - 00:03:17:05
Jessie Ott
It's cold up there.

00:03:17:07 - 00:03:34:15
Thomas Angel
I get you, I get you, but the minute you go over to the east side of the Cascades, whether that's in Washington or Oregon, where we live, it's, very similar to Colorado. So 300 days of sunshine, high desert, very dry. A little bit more extreme weather, right? So in the summer, it's a lot hotter.

00:03:34:16 - 00:03:46:05
Thomas Angel
And in the winter, it's, it's a heck of a lot colder and a little bit more snow. So very, very different, you know, topography, geography, and, weather, weather patterns.

00:03:46:07 - 00:03:50:10
Jessie Ott
Which is perfect for growing grapes, right? For winemaking.

00:03:50:12 - 00:03:59:09
Thomas Angel
It is on the west side. Yeah, certainly like Willamette Valley. The wine there is, it's phenomenal. I mean, if you're a Pinot noir fan, that's kind of the Mecca.

00:03:59:11 - 00:04:07:07
Jessie Ott
It is. It is the Mecca. Absolutely. So what are you doing in Washington today?

00:04:07:09 - 00:04:10:06
Thomas Angel
We're making the rounds. So,

00:04:10:08 - 00:04:12:20
Jessie Ott
We run or.

00:04:12:22 - 00:04:32:22
Thomas Angel
We usually try to do everything all at once. So it's good. Yeah. I mean, just to be time efficient. So we do have, you know, distribution up here. We have, you know, quite a few accounts. And then, we used to also live in Seattle. So this was, you know, our stomping grounds for, for quite a few, years.

00:04:32:23 - 00:04:45:10
Thomas Angel
So a lot of friends and family up here as well, in addition to some advisors, and some, some investor meetings that we're having this week as well. So just trying to, you know, kill three birds with one stone, sort of, sort of a situation.

00:04:45:12 - 00:04:49:19
Jessie Ott
So what made you move from Washington to, to Oregon?

00:04:49:21 - 00:05:24:12
Thomas Angel
That's, it's, no, it's a long story, because I mean, really, we were. And if, you have looked at my LinkedIn, we actually were in Beijing, China, before moving to bend. Yeah. So we yeah, we had spent many years in, in Seattle. I went to university here, started working for Boeing outside of, at a university and had a lot of, great opportunities, through Boeing to, to live around the world and just happened to be, stationed out in Beijing for a couple of years and actually went from Beijing to bend.

00:05:24:16 - 00:05:47:03
Thomas Angel
So, you know, happy to dive into the details of that. But the reason why Oregon, I grew up in Oregon, I always was a huge fan of Central Oregon, you know, so actually living most of my life on the west side of the Cascades, where it's kind of gray and rainy, always, yearned for a little bit more sun, but maybe not having to leave the Pacific Northwest.

00:05:47:03 - 00:05:51:11
Thomas Angel
So, someplace like.

00:05:51:13 - 00:05:54:21
Thomas Angel
Exactly, exactly. You learned that pretty quick living in the northwest.

00:05:54:23 - 00:06:06:02
Jessie Ott
Yeah, I remember with Saint Michelle, I used to work with them, and, anytime you had somebody move into the area, they're like, get your vitamin D supplements. Just take a.

00:06:06:04 - 00:06:08:01
Thomas Angel
Yep.

00:06:08:03 - 00:06:24:05
Thomas Angel
Oh, yeah. Yeah. I mean, it's, it's heaven on earth. Three months out of the year in the Pacific Northwest, at least in the west end of the Cascades. The summers, you know, unbeatable. But, about October through, October through May is, Yeah, let's just say it's a little gray.

00:06:24:07 - 00:06:42:06
Jessie Ott
Yeah. I remember going up there with with Saint Michel, and I was talking to someone that worked at the winery, and he said, we live for these three months of summer in the world. And they are. It was lovely. I got to hike and do a lot of fun stuff up there, so nothing short of cool activities for sure.

00:06:42:08 - 00:06:45:11
Jessie Ott
But it's not all year round, unfortunately.

00:06:45:13 - 00:06:58:19
Thomas Angel
Yeah, but on the flip side of the coin, I think that's why there's so many successful companies in the Pacific Northwest. Because I think, you know, you're almost forced to just stay and innovate and build companies, you know, nine months out of the year.

00:06:58:21 - 00:07:02:04
Thomas Angel
Yeah. Yeah, I.

00:07:02:08 - 00:07:06:21
Thomas Angel
Might as well go start Microsoft or, you know, Amazon or Boeing or whatever.

00:07:06:23 - 00:07:15:00
Jessie Ott
Whatever. Something big I love that. So you are from Oregon where.

00:07:15:02 - 00:07:17:08
Thomas Angel
Yes, I grew up in, in Portland, Oregon.

00:07:17:13 - 00:07:18:19
Thomas Angel


00:07:18:21 - 00:07:42:18
Thomas Angel
And yeah, basically lived there until university went to Seattle University, a small Jesuit school in downtown Seattle. And, yeah, ended up, you know, partly because of, you know, what I was studying and partly because of my passion in aviation. I ended up in, in Boeing, and spent almost ten years there.

00:07:42:20 - 00:07:48:03
Jessie Ott
So how did you see Boeing? Is it through the school or through contacts or.

00:07:48:05 - 00:08:10:12
Thomas Angel
Yeah, it was a combination. I mean, Seattle University is kind of nicknamed Boeing University. Most of the people who go out and get like an MBA or higher education degree, go to Seattle University. You know, it's right in Seattle. They have a great relationship with a company. So there was always, you know, representatives from the company on campus and, you know, I'm always transparent.

00:08:10:12 - 00:08:25:02
Thomas Angel
You know, the thing that got me was these companies come on to campus and, you know, they try to incentivize you with with food. Right? You're a poor college kid. So, you know, Boeing had, Boeing had free pizza.

00:08:25:04 - 00:08:26:07
Thomas Angel
Doing every. Yeah.

00:08:26:09 - 00:08:50:12
Thomas Angel
Exactly, exactly. And, yeah, I know, ended up being, you know, a fantastic opportunity for me, got to live in, you know, three different countries and a couple of different cities and, really amazing career opportunities. You know, as I alluded to before, ended up, you know, in Beijing, working with the Chinese government, an incredible life experience.

00:08:50:14 - 00:09:05:11
Thomas Angel
And, yeah, it was kind of our plan for the foreseeable future until 2020 rolled around and there was this little virus called, you know, coronavirus. Maybe you've heard of it.

00:09:05:13 - 00:09:07:12
Thomas Angel
For the first time.

00:09:07:13 - 00:09:30:05
Thomas Angel
Yes. Yes. And, I'm sorry to hear about that. So, yeah, that was, kind of a wrench in our plans, and, ended up getting caught outside of China and couldn't go back and kind of had to figure out what we want to do with our lives. And that's kind of the the genesis of why we completely did a 180 in our lives and moved to bend, Oregon and started a beverage company.

00:09:30:07 - 00:09:51:08
Jessie Ott
Wow. That's fascinating. So let's go back a little bit more because I'm, I'm really interested in your career. So you're a student in Seattle and you got pizza bought for you. And you, you heard this people. And they're like, come intern or come work part time or come, come, come like get started.

00:09:51:10 - 00:10:17:20
Thomas Angel
Yeah. So it was kind of, if you want to go far back. I had actually studied biochemistry and everyone I families in, in the health care profession, you know, doctors, nurses, you know, health care providers. And so, you know, the path that I was sort of set on was to go, you know, to med school. And I was working at the hospital there and downtown Seattle Harbor view was pretty miserable, to be honest with you.

00:10:17:22 - 00:10:37:23
Thomas Angel
Really just kind of was like, oh, so I was working on a psychiatric study, at Harborview, which is a level one trauma center. So you see a lot of, a lot of interesting things there. And, yeah, I enjoyed my classes. You know, it's a very, you know, interesting path with biochem and pre-med and all that.

00:10:37:23 - 00:10:59:14
Thomas Angel
But I really wasn't feeling super fulfilled. So, around my it was my junior year, I switched over to the business school, and almost immediately kind of felt this, like breath of like, oh, like, you know, purpose and, you know, sense of like, okay. Like I'm actually, you know, seeing something that I want to do, ten, 15, 20 years down the road.

00:10:59:16 - 00:11:17:11
Thomas Angel
And it was right around then that, you know, as I mentioned, you had these companies that would come through the business school and, you know, pitch their company to go do an internship. And so Boeing was one of them. And, you know, I just heard the people there talking about, you know, their experiences and the career opportunities they had.

00:11:17:13 - 00:11:47:06
Thomas Angel
And, yeah. So I was like, okay, I'll give it a shot. So I did an internship there. I was so I started off in like the most, like, inner bowels of the company, working on, you know, basic an engineering team, in Everett. And I'm not an engineer. So it was kind of like the operations side of, you know, an engineering organization, within Everett, which is where their large production facility was.

00:11:47:08 - 00:11:59:08
Thomas Angel
And so I, you know, be 100% transparent. The actual job itself was not very exciting, but the location of where the internship was was in the Everett production facility, which if you Google.

00:11:59:09 - 00:12:01:01
Jessie Ott
What's going on. Yeah.

00:12:01:03 - 00:12:27:19
Thomas Angel
Yeah. I don't know if I've ever had a chance to go into that facility, but it's, at least at the time, was the largest building on Earth by square volume. Yeah. You can fit like, you know. Yeah, you can fit all of Disneyland in it. It's it's incredible. Yeah. So that kind of experience really kind of just sparked my, you know, my passion for, you know, for the airplanes, for the industry.

00:12:27:19 - 00:12:39:00
Thomas Angel
And, you came back to the second internship, got accepted to a, you know, leadership rotation program there, and kind of, just kept on building into my career there.

00:12:39:01 - 00:12:42:10
Jessie Ott
And so did you keep moving around to different departments?

00:12:42:11 - 00:12:43:20
Thomas Angel
Yeah. Yes.

00:12:43:22 - 00:12:51:18
Jessie Ott
Things that they were kind of not pushing you towards, but maybe, you know, helping you facilitate what you were good at and what you knew.

00:12:51:20 - 00:13:17:13
Thomas Angel
Yes. Okay, I got lucky. I got, to be part of, a leadership rotation program there, you know, as I started, you know, straight out of college. So I rotated into six different, placements within two years. So I did everything from, you know, financial planning to, you know, marketing to sales to, you know, operations.

00:13:17:13 - 00:13:32:03
Thomas Angel
You know, I got to spend four months in Italy, you know, working on, an inventory recovery project with a supplier there. Yeah. Just. Yeah, just all kinds of things. And, you know, the whole purpose of that.

00:13:32:05 - 00:13:34:21
Jessie Ott
Is the leadership that's part of the rotation.

00:13:34:23 - 00:13:59:19
Thomas Angel
Yeah, part of the rotation. I mean, you know, the concept was get you enough exposure into all the different areas of the company, both from a business unit and also from a functional unit perspective. To be able to, you know, exit out of it and have, you know, a, a holistic view of how the company runs and, you know, be able to, you know, apply those lessons into, you know, the various parts of the company that you would go on to.

00:13:59:21 - 00:14:02:08
Jessie Ott
So where were you in Italy?

00:14:02:10 - 00:14:40:23
Thomas Angel
We were in a tiny town, called Grow Italia. It's in Pula. So if you know, like the geography of Italy, it's like the heel of the boot camp. And, yeah, we were down there. Yeah, yeah, we we had, a major supplier that made the center section of the seven, eight, seven and, yeah, we were having some issues where we had took over their supply chain and their inventory costs had ballooned, and so they needed some support to go in and figure out how to, you know, get that under control and so, yeah, so it was it was an amazing opportunity to go out there for four months and eat a

00:14:40:23 - 00:14:41:18
Thomas Angel
lot of pasta.

00:14:41:19 - 00:14:47:04
Jessie Ott
Favorite word supply chain.

00:14:47:06 - 00:14:47:09
Thomas Angel
Yeah.

00:14:47:09 - 00:14:49:03
Thomas Angel
Certainly nowadays.

00:14:49:05 - 00:15:03:00
Jessie Ott
Yeah. So that's really cool. So you got interesting exposure to it early on. So and with the different rotations you certainly got to experience different departments which I'm sure helped create your fundamentals for your company to.

00:15:03:02 - 00:15:29:00
Thomas Angel
Yeah, absolutely. I mean, you know, just opportunity to see how, you know, a company the size of Boeing, you know, at the time was, you know, over $100 billion market cap company, you know, fortune 20 company, to see just how its run from, you know, business units, obviously in the Pacific Northwest, the main business unit is commercial aviation, but obviously defense and space.

00:15:29:02 - 00:15:47:20
Thomas Angel
You know, to, you know, private aviation, general aviation, I mean, they really cover the whole, you know, the whole verticals of, of aviation. Yeah. No, it was it was phenomenal experience. Absolutely learned a ton. You know, got so much exposure in such a short amount of time. And really.

00:15:47:22 - 00:15:50:07
Jessie Ott
I'm sure networking.

00:15:50:09 - 00:15:51:09
Thomas Angel
Absolutely.

00:15:51:11 - 00:15:54:05
Jessie Ott
After Italy, you come back to Seattle, then?

00:15:54:07 - 00:16:24:15
Thomas Angel
Yeah. Came back to Seattle. Went into our. By that point, I had exited, the leadership rotation program and, went into our, our commercial headquarters building, in, in Renton and, went into the core sales and marketing, group and started working with, you know, airline customers. And that's kind of what set me on the path towards, towards, living in China.

00:16:24:17 - 00:16:32:14
Thomas Angel
You know, I in full disclosure, I did study Chinese, so I had Chinese language capabilities, but,

00:16:32:16 - 00:16:34:19
Thomas Angel
Yeah. Okay. Yeah.

00:16:34:21 - 00:16:36:00
Jessie Ott
I loved it.

00:16:36:02 - 00:16:53:20
Thomas Angel
Yeah, yeah, it's I mean, same thing. Got to spend a semester in, in Shanghai and, so, you know, because of that, right? Once you have Mandarin and Chinese experience in your resume, you always kind of get thrown towards, you know, projects, related to China. And so started working.

00:16:53:21 - 00:16:54:06
Thomas Angel
And you get.

00:16:54:06 - 00:17:00:07
Jessie Ott
To finally use those skills like, I'd, I've never used my French skills at all. And, and that's gone.

00:17:00:09 - 00:17:18:16
Thomas Angel
Yeah. Yeah, 100%. Yeah. If you don't use it, you lose it. Absolutely. But yeah. So you know, went from, you know, working with our airline customers in China to getting the opportunity through that, to actually go and live over there, and work with, the Chinese government.

00:17:18:18 - 00:17:20:19
Jessie Ott
Over there that.

00:17:20:21 - 00:17:51:19
Thomas Angel
Yeah. So you can imagine any of the major airlines, right, like Air China, China, southern Hainan, you know, the, the big three, as they call them, to smaller airlines, like, really, you know, regional airlines. But at the end of the day in China, whether you're those large, government owned airlines or even a small private airline, everything is ultimately, managed by the Chinese government.

00:17:51:21 - 00:18:41:09
Thomas Angel
So it's it's a state directed economy. Any, imports, or for that matter, exports as well are controlled by the National Development Reform Commission, the Ndrc. So that's, kind of where I came in and, you know, worked with our organizations there to basically influence, economic development and trade policy. Because even though our sales teams would go and work with the airlines on, you know, what their their needs were for their for their fleets, based off of growth plans, you know, passenger numbers, etcetera, etcetera, new route openings in order to actually get the approval for that, for that airplane order, you had to work with the government to figure

00:18:41:09 - 00:19:06:20
Thomas Angel
out how it fit into their, you know, their three year, five year or seven year plans. Because, you know, these are incredibly, you know, expensive large pieces of the US, you know, China trade, relationship, actually at the time, and I still believe it is, it's the single largest dollar item trade items, between the US and China.

00:19:06:22 - 00:19:13:00
Jessie Ott
That makes total sense. So was the State Department ever involved in any of those things as well? Then I guess it's.

00:19:13:02 - 00:19:15:07
Thomas Angel
100%. Yeah, 100% growth.

00:19:15:10 - 00:19:16:13
Thomas Angel
Yeah.

00:19:16:14 - 00:19:42:04
Thomas Angel
Yeah, yeah. I mean, this is obviously there's the Boeing view of things, right. You know what we need for our growth plans. There's obviously the airline view of things and what the airline needed for their, you know, their fleet planning and their, you know, network planning. But obviously there was a lot of it that, you know, I mean, basically anytime there was, you know, major aircraft order announcements, it was usually executed at, state visits.

00:19:42:04 - 00:20:07:04
Thomas Angel
So whether that was the, you know, the Chinese premier coming to the US or the US president going to China. So, you know, it's pretty cool, right? You know, incredible experience to, to work on things that, you know, literally, you, you know, having meetings at, you know, the, the embassy in Beijing or, you know, going to, you know, DC and facilitating meetings there at the white House and, you know, pretty, pretty impactful thing.

00:20:07:04 - 00:20:10:00
Thomas Angel
So it's really an incredible career opportunity.

00:20:10:02 - 00:20:16:11
Jessie Ott
Yeah. That is really fun. That is super cool. So, do you miss it?

00:20:16:13 - 00:20:37:19
Thomas Angel
Yeah, of course. Obviously. I mean, you know, that was my life or, you know, almost ten years and, you know, it was, truly an incredible experience. I, I won't say that, you know, it's something that I don't, you know, miss at all, but at the same time, you know, part of the motivation, I've always had a very entrepreneurial spirit.

00:20:37:21 - 00:20:56:20
Thomas Angel
You know, I was a kid that, you know, growing up, always had the lemonade stand. And, you know, even when I was an undergrad, you it I was always, you know, trying to figure out businesses to start and, you know, had the opportunity pretty actually early on in my, in my career at Boeing, to participate in I don't know if you heard of an organization called Startup Weekend.

00:20:56:22 - 00:21:14:20
Thomas Angel
Yeah. Check it out. It's pretty cool. Like you basically go and you pitch an idea on a Friday, and by Sunday, you know, with a team that you build over that weekend, you pitch, a minimum viable product, to, you know, a small group of investor, you know, service providers, and then you can get a little bit of seed funding.

00:21:14:22 - 00:21:47:14
Thomas Angel
And so I actually yeah, one one for a financial literacy app idea, back in 2014. And yeah, and it was one of those moments where it was like, yeah, I had just kind of started my career in Boeing, you know, I don't come from, you know, trust fund or anything like that. So it was kind of those moments where I was like, all right, am I going to like, quit my job and do this or am I going to have to, you know, do what most people do is, you know, build a career, build some, you know, a little bit of a nest egg and then figure out how to, you know, go into

00:21:47:14 - 00:22:03:19
Thomas Angel
entrepreneurship and, you know, so those moments where, you know, the idea, I liked it, but I didn't love it. And it wasn't one of those things where it's like, am I willing to risk it all? But that itch never went away, right? It was one of things where even with the amazing career opportunities that I had. Yeah.

00:22:03:21 - 00:22:35:07
Thomas Angel
You know, I was always wants people, right? You you watch Shark Tank, you always, you know, kind of, you know, read TechCrunch or. And yeah. So that's ultimately, you know, for, for me now it's like, yeah. Looking back to opportunities and a, you know, company like Boeing and, you know, a corporate career like that. Amazing. But the fulfillment and, you know, kind of the risk reward that you get from, you know, entrepreneurial life is it's addictive.

00:22:35:09 - 00:22:47:21
Jessie Ott
It's fun. It it is absolutely fun. I am 100% with you. I've I have so many ideas. That's another podcast. If anybody wants a load of ideas, I got them.

00:22:47:23 - 00:22:51:19
Thomas Angel
Well, maybe there'll be a Startup Idea Friday podcast or something.

00:22:52:00 - 00:22:54:01
Jessie Ott
Yeah. There you go. Startup Fridays. I like.

00:22:54:01 - 00:22:57:03
Thomas Angel
It.

00:22:57:05 - 00:23:05:00
Jessie Ott
They'll have one for every day of the week. We're going to do foodie, and, Tuesday beverages. There's tech startups up Friday I.

00:23:05:00 - 00:23:07:23
Thomas Angel
Like it I like it.

00:23:08:01 - 00:23:20:03
Jessie Ott
Okay. So you're over in China, and, you said you got, you were you left China and you could get back in, like, tell tell us more about that.

00:23:20:05 - 00:23:47:15
Thomas Angel
Yeah. Yeah. So, you know, obviously, coronavirus hit China a lot sooner than the rest of the world. So we first started to feel the impact of it. Around Chinese New Year. So this was end of January of 2020 and, yeah, at the time, you know, kind of got stuck there for a little bit, if you can believe it, the whole sort of focus then was about getting medical supplies into China.

00:23:47:17 - 00:24:10:03
Thomas Angel
And so Boeing had committed, you know, very publicly to support, which was, you know, amazing. Right? You know, donating masks and ventilators and medical equipment and PPE. And so, you know, that was my job, to help coordinate that effort and bring all these things in and, you know, really incredible, you know, effort by the whole organization.

00:24:10:03 - 00:24:31:12
Thomas Angel
And, you know, a lot of, suppliers. And so it was a crazy, you know, a few months and then in March, things at the time actually kind of started to get better, right? Things were kind of starting to open up in China. Life was slowly kind of trying to get back to normal. And so there was this.

00:24:31:14 - 00:24:53:22
Thomas Angel
Yeah. Well, that's when it started for. Well, so, it was the second week of March. And, you know, things started to seem like on the, the up and up. And so I kind of had this window where I was like, oh, wow. Okay. Well, you know, I've been working like basically like 24 over seven, you know, for the last two months trying to, you know, coordinate all these efforts.

00:24:54:00 - 00:25:36:07
Thomas Angel
And I was like, all right, well, maybe this is the time to go out and, you know, get a vacation, you know? And so, so my partner, my my wife is, is Colombian. I'm half Colombian. So we're like, all right, well, let's go back to Colombia and, you know, spend two weeks there and kind of decompress and, you know, sort of just, you know, get out of China for a little bit, you know, had been, you know, super crazy and, you know, flew to to Bogota from Beijing on on March 13th, arrived there on March 13th and within three days, four days, they had a simulated quarantine in Colombia because obviously

00:25:36:07 - 00:25:40:23
Thomas Angel
that's right around the time when the rest of the world started to catch up with the virus and.

00:25:41:00 - 00:25:45:18
Jessie Ott
It was like crashing. I mean, it was really bad over there.

00:25:45:20 - 00:26:08:19
Thomas Angel
Yeah, yeah. I mean, it was a weird time, right? Where it was like this sort of. Yeah, just, you know, uncertainty and really the, you know, the major impact for us was we end up getting stuck, we got stuck in Bogota for three months. They completely shut down the country. All the airports are closed. And then they shut down China.

00:26:08:19 - 00:26:29:11
Thomas Angel
So, yeah, it was this weird kind of moment where it was like, all right, what are we gonna do with our lives? And continue to work remotely, you know, for the next couple months and eventually was able to take a humanitarian flight, from Colombia back to the US. And, about that time we we went to Washington, DC.

00:26:29:11 - 00:26:52:03
Thomas Angel
This was June of 2020 and spent a week going to the the US embassy just trying to figure out how do we get back into China, you know, how do we get a reentry permit? That's where our life was. That's where our home was. And, yeah, at the end of it, they were just kind of like, hey, listen, like, you know, unless you have, you know, sick family there.

00:26:52:04 - 00:27:06:17
Thomas Angel
There's no, there's no opportunity right now. You know, our recommendation is figure out a plan B, so so we did so we, you know, coordinated a virtual move, got all our stuff back, you know, at least on the way back to the US.

00:27:06:19 - 00:27:11:05
Jessie Ott
We were able to kind of close down everything over there and get your stuff back because.

00:27:11:05 - 00:27:12:02
Thomas Angel
Yeah, that's.

00:27:12:04 - 00:27:15:22
Jessie Ott
That's like, I can't imagine just not having access to my home.

00:27:16:00 - 00:27:20:09
Thomas Angel
Yeah. It was, it was it, it was a weird and stressful time.

00:27:20:11 - 00:27:21:11
Thomas Angel
Yeah.

00:27:21:13 - 00:27:47:15
Thomas Angel
But you know, relatively speaking, you know, compared to what other people had to deal with in 2020. I mean, that was nothing, right? You know, that was just logistical stuff. And so, so yeah, around that time, you know, we had made it back to Seattle and, you know, I had an opportunity to go back with, you know, basically the team I was in before and, in marketing and, you know, my, my wife is, a software developer.

00:27:47:15 - 00:27:57:22
Thomas Angel
So, you know, she would have had, you know, plethora of opportunities to go and work for any of the tech companies in Seattle. And it just it didn't feel right, you know, as well as moments where.

00:27:58:00 - 00:27:59:22
Jessie Ott
You wanted to move forward.

00:28:00:00 - 00:28:21:06
Thomas Angel
Yeah. Or just, you know, it was kind of like, you know, when life, you know, throws, a curveball at you like that, you know, you can either, you know, choose to sort of, you know, sit back and sort of, you know, just hunker down and, you know, focus on what you're already doing or you can, you know, take a swing and, you know, look at it as, you know, a silver lining kind of a situation.

00:28:21:06 - 00:28:42:10
Thomas Angel
And so, it was one of those moments for us where it was like, you know what? Why don't we look at to, you know, some opportunities to to start our own company? And why don't we look at maybe moving someplace other than where we had been living and like, all these kinds of things. And so it kind of created this sort of swell of ideas.

00:28:42:10 - 00:29:05:20
Thomas Angel
And we, you know, we went to Atlanta for a little bit and visited family and thought, you know, maybe do something. Atlanta. Then we spent some time in San Diego and, you know, or just the whole time kind of just like brainstorming and thinking and at the same time, you know, this is the first time we had lived in the US in a few years, like a lot of people kind of experience living abroad for few years.

00:29:05:20 - 00:29:34:17
Thomas Angel
You had that reverse culture shock. And, you know, one of the major things for us that was just like, you know, what is going on is the amount of friends and family that were taking, like, these functional ingredients. Right? So, you know, my, you know, 67 year old mom was taking hemp CBD and, you know, our close friends were taking charge, and ashwagandha, lion's mane and rhodiola.

00:29:34:17 - 00:29:55:01
Thomas Angel
And it was it was kind of like, what's going on here? You know, these are people who aren't necessarily like, you know, the, let's say the more, left leaning when it comes to, you know, crystals and, you know, co-ops and, you know, kind of like average everyday consumers, you know, people who don't even drink kombucha.

00:29:55:01 - 00:30:02:03
Thomas Angel
Right? And here they are, like taking these functional ingredients. And it was like, is it Covid or.

00:30:02:03 - 00:30:04:23
Jessie Ott
It was it was unrelated.

00:30:05:01 - 00:30:27:21
Thomas Angel
I think it was a combination of things. I think, you know, there had already been a groundswell, you know, certainly with CBD, obviously, the farm bill back in 2018, I think for some of these other things, like functional mushrooms, people like Paul Stamets, you know, kind of finally getting some traction, you know, kind of outside, you know, the small niches that he had before.

00:30:27:23 - 00:30:48:09
Thomas Angel
And I think, yeah, Covid kind of accelerated because people were a little bit more focused on their health. And, you know, how do I how do I live a better life? How do I feel better? And, yeah, it was kind of like, well, okay, well, I don't know what the heck any of these things are, but these are close friends and family that, you know, we love and trust.

00:30:48:11 - 00:31:14:20
Thomas Angel
Sure. Like, let's let's try it. And, you know, the first question is, how do you take these things? And inevitably, at the time, certainly the majority of these function ingredients were powders and tinctures and maybe gummies or capsules and, you know, we're pretty, pretty average consumers ourselves. So we were like, I don't think this is going to work, right?

00:31:14:20 - 00:31:19:05
Thomas Angel
Like, I don't take any of these kinds of things or I don't take powders.

00:31:19:07 - 00:31:25:14
Jessie Ott
D all the, all the things you're supposed to take now to stop the replication of Covid, right? Because.

00:31:25:14 - 00:31:28:11
Thomas Angel
Yeah, but but like, just.

00:31:28:13 - 00:31:33:18
Jessie Ott
The pills from Saturday to Sunday or. Yeah, full of all this stuff you're supposed to.

00:31:33:18 - 00:31:35:16
Thomas Angel
Take with.

00:31:35:18 - 00:31:56:00
Thomas Angel
Which if you're able to do that, you know, more power to you. But yeah, the majority of consumers, the majority of people, it's, you know, unless it's like a medication, you know, that you're required to take. And that's the classic, you know, so or analogy, right, of, you know, are you a vitamin or a painkiller. And the majority of vitamins.

00:31:56:00 - 00:32:15:15
Thomas Angel
Right. It's like it's a good to have. But you know, you might take it for like a week religiously and then also, you know, you go on a trip or, you know, you got a crazy week at work or whatever, and all a sudden it gets thrown off and boom, like that routine is gone. So so we were like, all right, well, how do we how do we incorporate these things?

00:32:15:15 - 00:32:43:21
Thomas Angel
And also knowing that with any of these functional gradients, we were told, hey, you know, you're not going to feel the benefit like from one day to another, you got to take it consistently. So so we looked at our, you know, our daily routine. And the most consistent thing that we had in our routine was coffee. Right? There was not a single day that went under that went by that we didn't have a cup of coffee and,

00:32:43:23 - 00:32:45:04
Thomas Angel
Yeah.

00:32:45:06 - 00:32:51:01
Jessie Ott
It smells good. It tastes good. It wakes you up. It's a routine. It's your morning routine, right?

00:32:51:03 - 00:33:04:15
Thomas Angel
100%. 100%. And so, you know, so we're, you know, I'm half Colombian. My wife is Colombian. Like, it's it's also like a religion, too, right? So it's not even like most things where it's like, oh, we were trying to quit coffee, you know, it was like, oh, we love coffee. Like, it's like we grew up with it.

00:33:04:15 - 00:33:18:12
Thomas Angel
Like it's. It's part of, like, our ritual every morning. So, so we're like, okay, cool. Let's, let's try putting these things into our coffee in the morning. And, we did. It tasted terrible.

00:33:18:13 - 00:33:19:07
Thomas Angel
It was.

00:33:19:09 - 00:33:37:06
Thomas Angel
It was absolutely horrible. But we kept, we we were trying everything. Right, because, you know, we had friends who were like, you know, sending us links like, oh, you got to try, like turkey tail. Oh, you got to try, like, you know, l-theanine. Oh, you're going to try, you know, rhodiola, like, you know, I could show you, you know, photos from summer 2020.

00:33:37:06 - 00:33:59:16
Thomas Angel
In our cupboard, we had all these little packets from, like, bulk supplements, dot com, and, you know, always like, you know, you know, individual providers. And we just like, it looked like a, like a laboratory, you know, we just had like, you know, dozens upon dozens of these like little like, you know, packets and containers and tincture drops and you know, so we were like, all right, cool.

00:33:59:16 - 00:34:20:19
Thomas Angel
Well, you know, it is becoming more consistent, but it's hard, right? Like, it's hard for us because it's like it doesn't taste super great. So we're kind of choking it down. So we just we're on the path of like, right. Well, how do we make it taste good? Right? How do we make it enjoyable? So we started adding things that were real ingredients that were, you know, good for you.

00:34:20:19 - 00:34:25:19
Thomas Angel
Not just like dumping a bunch of sugar into it. Right. But, you know, added.

00:34:25:21 - 00:34:27:16
Jessie Ott
This year, 2020.

00:34:27:18 - 00:34:33:10
Thomas Angel
This is 2020. So this is, like August, September of 2020.

00:34:33:12 - 00:34:39:07
Jessie Ott
So there were different options out there, but not not a lot really.

00:34:39:09 - 00:35:07:09
Thomas Angel
Really not a lot. I mean, at that time, you know, there was nothing really ready to drink, probably say the most kind of accessible thing at the time was like, rebel, rebel, you know, they had, you know, kind of like, almost like a smoothie type thing. And yeah, like, you know, pretty decent products. But the one thing that for us was a lot of those things, they really only focused on one benefit.

00:35:07:11 - 00:35:28:10
Thomas Angel
It'd be like immunity, like, this is an immunity drink, and this is like a recovery. And this is like a cognition. And this is, you know, anti-inflammatory dairy and, you know, like $7 for like, one thing. And it was like, you know, one, don't you want all those things? Like, who wakes up one morning and goes, you know what?

00:35:28:10 - 00:35:47:05
Thomas Angel
Today I could use some cognitive support and, you know, maybe tomorrow I could use some immune support. And it's like, no, you want all those things, right? Like, who wants who wants to choose between all these great benefits? And then, you know, it's like a piece of it too, is like, you know, I don't want unless I have to spend, you know, 7 or $8, you know, for ready to drink.

00:35:47:05 - 00:36:09:01
Thomas Angel
That only has one of those benefits. And by the way, a lot of them, too. And not calling out rebel rebels. Actually, I think probably one of the better ones, you know, some of these ones that you would, you know, buy, you'd spend 7 or $8 on it, you know, the co-op or the Whole Foods, and you'd open it, you take a sip and you go, this I'm sure is super healthy, super great for me.

00:36:09:03 - 00:36:14:04
Thomas Angel
I don't think I could take another sip.

00:36:14:06 - 00:36:29:17
Thomas Angel
And so, so yeah, so kind of, you know, just led, you know, to our, you know, our need, right? Our, our pain point was like, all right, well, how do we make a routine based? How do we make it taste good? How do we, like, have these full benefits that are out there in a way where we're not having to pick and choose?

00:36:29:19 - 00:36:42:08
Thomas Angel
And, yeah, that's kind of what led to what our first product was, which was just our little kitchen, you know, recipe, which at the time we called it everything latte. Now it's our mocha coffee.

00:36:42:10 - 00:36:44:02
Jessie Ott
Okay.

00:36:44:04 - 00:36:59:05
Thomas Angel
Yeah. But that was. Yeah, that was kind of what? Yeah. Shake. Well, yeah. Yeah, yeah. Yeah. I mean, there's a lot of great. Yeah. You want, you want to you want to crack one open.

00:36:59:07 - 00:37:00:05
Thomas Angel
Let's do it.

00:37:00:07 - 00:37:04:02
Thomas Angel
All right. Let's do it. Yeah. So this is.

00:37:04:03 - 00:37:07:16
Jessie Ott
I'm going to pour it in my glass here.

00:37:07:18 - 00:37:09:04
Thomas Angel
Actually. Okay. All right.

00:37:09:07 - 00:37:12:03
Jessie Ott
Okay. So open it slow.

00:37:12:05 - 00:37:14:15
Thomas Angel
Yeah. Open it slow.

00:37:14:17 - 00:37:15:06
Jessie Ott
Okay.

00:37:15:08 - 00:37:16:13
Thomas Angel
Not too bad.

00:37:16:15 - 00:37:17:20
Jessie Ott
All right.

00:37:17:22 - 00:37:23:10
Thomas Angel
Yeah, yeah. So, you know, we use, organic base.

00:37:23:12 - 00:37:24:01
Thomas Angel


00:37:24:03 - 00:37:27:13
Jessie Ott
Yummy. Oatmilk is my favorite.

00:37:27:15 - 00:37:45:14
Thomas Angel
Oh. It's amazing. It's amazing. Yeah. And that was one. You know, I think for us, right, in terms of searching for ways to make it delicious, that. But also it was healthy. You know, we're not necessarily vegan ourself. But yeah, we were looking at ways to reduce the amount of animal products in our life, mostly from a sustainability perspective.

00:37:45:16 - 00:37:53:04
Thomas Angel
And, yeah. Thank you. Yeah. Oat milk was one of the things where like it's kept on going towards. Right.

00:37:53:04 - 00:37:58:12
Jessie Ott
Because it's I would never have to eat a banana again.

00:37:58:14 - 00:37:59:09
Thomas Angel
Yeah.

00:37:59:11 - 00:38:00:17
Thomas Angel
Decent amount of potassium and there isn't.

00:38:00:17 - 00:38:01:02
Thomas Angel
A.

00:38:01:04 - 00:38:06:09
Jessie Ott
Decent amount of potassium I love it. Okay, so talk about the name.

00:38:06:11 - 00:38:22:22
Thomas Angel
Yeah. Altitude. Yeah yeah, yeah. So, you know, right around that time when we kind of were like, okay, well maybe this is the product that we want to, or this is the business we want to go about. Yeah. The first thing that you always think of as an entrepreneur is, okay, well, we're going to call the company, right?

00:38:22:22 - 00:38:27:16
Thomas Angel
Yeah, that's the fun part, right? That's like the most fun part of it.

00:38:27:18 - 00:38:32:22
Jessie Ott
And you create a podcast in a week and go, oh, that's it, that's it.

00:38:33:00 - 00:38:45:11
Thomas Angel
That's okay too, right? Like I'm a I'm a firm believer and just, just go to start something. It's better to yeah have something and change it than like, you know sit and theorize and theorize and, you know, never actually end up starting anything.

00:38:45:11 - 00:38:50:15
Jessie Ott
You never do it. That's that's my problem. I with my all my ideas anyway go okay.

00:38:50:15 - 00:38:52:07
Thomas Angel
So yeah. Yeah.

00:38:52:07 - 00:39:23:16
Thomas Angel
So so altitude it was we came up with the idea when we knew that we were moving to bend. So we decided to move to Bend in September and move there in October. And, you know, we're kind of building this idea, this company, as we're moving there. And it was kind of like most things where I was like, all right, well, the, kind of three fold one, like, you know, the core of why we wanted to start this was about like elevating your routine, elevating, you know, the way that you live, right?

00:39:23:16 - 00:39:46:06
Thomas Angel
By utilizing these great functional ingredients. You know, second part of it was also like, you know, bends at altitude, right? Bend is a little bit higher up there. And then third, you know, it was a little bit of a nod to, to my aviation, you know, you know, career and this kind of idea of, you know, living life, you know, sort of that aptitude.

00:39:46:08 - 00:40:00:23
Thomas Angel
So it just kind of made sense. And, you know, obviously, like the first thing you do is you go on the, you know, the US Patent and Trademark Office website and you your search engine to see, you know, who else has that. Yeah. There was there actually was a company that was a cold brew company in LA.

00:40:01:01 - 00:40:19:03
Thomas Angel
I don't believe they're in business anymore, but that was our initial filing. Was, you know, to be altitude. And it was at that point it was already dead. You know, the filing, and they had switched the name to I think it was split decision. So kind of word mix. I was like, oh, no, like I, you know, because you that's the other part about being an entrepreneur.

00:40:19:05 - 00:40:24:19
Thomas Angel
You find a name, you like it. And then you go out and you realize you're like, oh, wait, maybe I can't use it.

00:40:24:21 - 00:40:26:05
Thomas Angel
You know? Yes.

00:40:26:07 - 00:40:27:15
Jessie Ott
Exactly. Yes.

00:40:27:15 - 00:40:29:04
Thomas Angel
I

00:40:29:06 - 00:41:00:11
Thomas Angel
But but we got we got lucky. We got lucky that, you know, whoever was that, you know, had filed it, you decided to switch to something else and you abandoned it. So that was the very first thing that we did. Invested in was making sure that we secured, like our, you know, our trademarks and, you know, because that was one lesson learned that I had seen so many times from other entrepreneurs was, you know, you go out and you create a, a brand, a business or whatever, and you get pretty far down the road and then somebody, you know, goes, oh, actually, I already filed that.

00:41:00:11 - 00:41:04:15
Thomas Angel
And then you have to completely rebrand. And, you know, you're already like, you know, in retail.

00:41:04:16 - 00:41:09:07
Jessie Ott
Yeah, you have to pay $10,000 for your website.

00:41:09:09 - 00:41:12:19
Thomas Angel
Yeah, yeah.

00:41:12:21 - 00:41:24:09
Jessie Ott
Can I go back just a second because, I think it's really cool. So, so you're Colombian. Your wife is Colombian. So were you married before you went to China, then?

00:41:24:11 - 00:41:26:01
Thomas Angel
Yeah. Yeah.

00:41:26:03 - 00:41:29:10
Jessie Ott
And so was she involved with Boeing at all?

00:41:29:12 - 00:41:52:00
Thomas Angel
No, no, no, she was, Altitude. Yeah, yeah. So she's a partner in altitude. But, you know, Boeing and China, it was just her supporting my career. So she moved out to, to China, and, you know, she didn't speak Chinese. So, you know, she went through the process of, you know, learning Chinese. And, you know, she did do some contract stuff out there, but, yeah.

00:41:52:00 - 00:42:09:08
Thomas Angel
I mean, to be honest with you, you know why we started this? There was another kind of reason to, you know, kind of give it as an opportunity to, you know, to work on something together to build something, you know, and, you know, I'll be, you know, fully transparent, like, working in Boeing was incredible. But I was on the road a lot.

00:42:09:08 - 00:42:13:11
Thomas Angel
You know, I traveled minimum 100 to 150 days a year.

00:42:13:13 - 00:42:17:12
Jessie Ott
Well, didn't you work for the president of both?

00:42:17:14 - 00:42:18:00
Thomas Angel
Yeah.

00:42:18:01 - 00:42:19:10
Thomas Angel
Yeah, yeah. So obviously a.

00:42:19:10 - 00:42:20:17
Thomas Angel
Lot of.

00:42:20:19 - 00:42:21:10
Jessie Ott
I mean, you.

00:42:21:10 - 00:42:34:06
Thomas Angel
Know, for sure and great opportunity and amazing, amazing experiences, you know, getting to travel and do, you know, incredible meetings. Incredible. You know, events. But it's hard it's hard for relationship to be gone a lot.

00:42:34:09 - 00:42:38:12
Jessie Ott
You didn't speak the language. She. That would have been hard for sure.

00:42:38:12 - 00:42:39:15
Thomas Angel
For sure.

00:42:39:17 - 00:42:57:01
Jessie Ott
I was obsessed with going to China, I don't know, 15, 15 years ago, maybe. And I wanted to go to Shanghai and teach English and I realized, I don't know how I was going to afford it. I was going to be in like this teeny tiny little box. And I was like, I don't think I want to do that.

00:42:57:03 - 00:43:02:12
Jessie Ott
But yeah, what a but, you know, for her, hopefully she got out and got to travel a little bit on her own. And you.

00:43:02:12 - 00:43:03:18
Thomas Angel
See how. Yeah.

00:43:03:20 - 00:43:21:03
Thomas Angel
I mean, you talked to Laura and like, she'll say that that was like some of the best years of her life because like, I mean, what an incredible experience. Yeah. I mean, people always ask, right? Like, it's funny. I think part of it is, American preconceived notion of, you know, what China is like, and obviously you haven't been there.

00:43:21:04 - 00:43:39:10
Thomas Angel
You can you can test like it's an endlessly fascinating and interesting place. And is it a perfect place, you know, got no right like anywhere. Right. There's, you know, chaos. There's, you know, parts that can be just really, really, especially as a, you know, as a foreigner, it can be really difficult to understand, but it's an endlessly fascinating country.

00:43:39:10 - 00:43:41:00
Thomas Angel
You know, there's.

00:43:41:02 - 00:43:52:10
Jessie Ott
Also like a great American, expats there or aren't there a bunch of ways to connect with other Americans? Well, you for sure. And I know there is some in Shanghai.

00:43:52:12 - 00:44:12:09
Thomas Angel
Oh, 100, I mean, yeah, I mean, like, you know, we weren't living in, you know, Yunnan or, you know, sort of a desolate province. Right? Beijing is the capital, right? That's where all the embassies are. So there's, you know, a massive population of diplomats. It's an expat from companies. And, you know, we had an incredible, you know, diversity of friend group out there, right?

00:44:12:09 - 00:44:35:12
Thomas Angel
People that were, you know, Chinese that were actually, you know, Lao Beijing ran like people from Beijing to people who, you know, were from around China that lived there to diplomats from all over the world to, you know, fellow Americans that were, you know, working for either, you know, companies or teaching English or whatever it may be. I mean, it was it was an incredible diversity of people and and really an incredible life experience.

00:44:35:12 - 00:44:38:21
Thomas Angel
So, yeah, I always kind of chuckle when people kind of like.

00:44:38:23 - 00:44:39:02
Thomas Angel
To.

00:44:39:03 - 00:44:40:09
Jessie Ott
Have that. That's really cool.

00:44:40:09 - 00:44:56:19
Thomas Angel
Yeah. No, I mean, it was it was phenomenal. Phenomenal. But but, you know, one sort of benefit of starting your own company, right, is especially in our case where we started it together. You know, it cuts both ways for sure. But, you know, you get to spend a lot of time together. You get to build something together.

00:44:56:21 - 00:45:03:23
Thomas Angel
And yeah, I mean, it's something that, you know, I think even for together.

00:45:04:01 - 00:45:04:19
Thomas Angel
Yeah.

00:45:04:21 - 00:45:06:07
Thomas Angel
Exactly. Exactly.

00:45:06:07 - 00:45:11:13
Jessie Ott
You get to pick, what, 13 or 15 days you want off a year.

00:45:11:15 - 00:45:14:23
Thomas Angel
Oh, I wish we had that many days off a year.

00:45:15:01 - 00:45:17:16
Jessie Ott
I know it never ends right.

00:45:17:18 - 00:45:18:21
Thomas Angel


00:45:18:23 - 00:45:29:02
Jessie Ott
Okay. So you have the name and, you have this first one. So let's talk about the ingredients in here. All these great benefits. So you've got some lion's mane.

00:45:29:04 - 00:45:29:19
Thomas Angel


00:45:29:21 - 00:45:35:05
Thomas Angel
Yeah. Which is great for focus. Yeah. Cognition focus.

00:45:35:07 - 00:45:37:10
Jessie Ott
My wife says I need to focus all the time.

00:45:37:10 - 00:45:43:05
Thomas Angel
Maybe I get on with it or something. Not just not at all. Day long.

00:45:43:07 - 00:45:46:14
Jessie Ott
Focus, focus.

00:45:46:15 - 00:45:52:07
Thomas Angel
There you go. That's an idea for, for Startup Friday. Yeah. They main chocolate bars.

00:45:52:09 - 00:45:59:16
Jessie Ott
Chocolate bars. It's going to help me focus. Okay, I can't see. I should have my glasses on. So Chaga.

00:45:59:18 - 00:46:34:04
Thomas Angel
Yeah. It's, actually the most antioxidant dense substance that you can consume there. Mushrooms that grow on the side of birch trees. Yeah, even more than blueberries. Yeah. So, yeah. Really great for immune support. It's a fungus. It's a mushroom. Oh, yeah. Yeah, it grows on the sides of, birch trees and the Arctic Circle. So it's actually quite traditional within, like, Finnish and Russian, and like native, cultures to, honestly, a lot of them, they drink chugging tea.

00:46:34:06 - 00:46:45:21
Thomas Angel
So like, if you have, like, you know, Russian friends or Finnish friends or like, you know, NATO friends, like from in Alaska or like northern Canada. And you ask them about it like it's quite common.

00:46:45:23 - 00:46:52:16
Jessie Ott
Well, I guess since I can't stop getting Covid, I should probably.

00:46:52:18 - 00:46:53:23
Thomas Angel
Probably couldn't hurt.

00:46:54:01 - 00:46:57:16
Jessie Ott
Probably couldn't hurt. Okay, what else we got? Rishi.

00:46:57:18 - 00:47:06:00
Thomas Angel
Yeah. Racer. That's another, fungus. Yeah. Varying benefits for that. But, you know, gut health is certainly one of them.

00:47:06:02 - 00:47:11:16
Jessie Ott
Well, that's right up my alley. Gosh, this is just. Did you make this for me?

00:47:11:18 - 00:47:12:16
Thomas Angel
Do you like.

00:47:12:18 - 00:47:17:00
Jessie Ott
This? Has just. Yeah. Written all over it. Okay.

00:47:17:01 - 00:47:34:09
Thomas Angel
So cordyceps. Yeah. Yeah. Another fungus. Yeah. This is, one that's been kind of infamous lately, because I'm not sure if you've seen or heard of that. Series on HBO called The Last of Us.

00:47:34:11 - 00:47:35:17
Jessie Ott
Yes.

00:47:35:19 - 00:47:36:02
Thomas Angel
Yeah.

00:47:36:02 - 00:47:44:22
Jessie Ott
So that's seen it all. I've only seen, half of it. I, I think they finished it without me, so go ahead.

00:47:45:00 - 00:48:17:00
Thomas Angel
Yeah. No, that that's that's that's the fungus in the, in the movie. That's, you know, creating the virus or whatever, which obviously dictation all to me based off of a video game. But, yeah, it's it's. Yeah, yeah, yeah. But yeah, you know, the benefits they're really great for, like, endurance. Like, it's really well known within Chinese traditional medicine, to kind of help out, especially like people who are, like, athletes or endurance athletes, you know, with high altitude running.

00:48:17:02 - 00:48:23:17
Thomas Angel
Yeah. It's really good for, you know, just natural kind of energy performance, that kind of stuff.

00:48:23:19 - 00:48:35:00
Jessie Ott
Okay. So if people are getting tired at 3:00 in the afternoon, that might be a good thing to get them through the, the afternoon and get that endurance to the finish line.

00:48:35:02 - 00:48:37:07
Thomas Angel
Exactly, exactly.

00:48:37:09 - 00:48:41:18
Jessie Ott
Okay, so we've got turmeric and CBD.

00:48:41:20 - 00:49:04:01
Thomas Angel
Yeah, both really great anti-inflammatories. That's, you know, honestly, a lot of, the basis of why we started taking, both of those, I mean, especially hard drive CBD is, you know, especially, like, if you're, like, an active person, or, heck, even into somebody who has the aches and pains of, you know, just daily life. Right?

00:49:04:01 - 00:49:20:23
Thomas Angel
It's a great anti-inflammatory. But is one of the right with all those things, it's like in order to realize the benefits, you got to take it consistently, right? Because we hear that time and time again, people are like, oh, I took CBD once. I didn't feel anything. And it's like, yeah, like, of course, right.

00:49:21:01 - 00:49:24:08
Jessie Ott
So how often should I be drinking these? Then?

00:49:24:10 - 00:49:29:22
Thomas Angel
Well, clearly three times a day. And you can get on a subscription at altitude. Babcock now.

00:49:30:00 - 00:49:32:12
Thomas Angel
Okay. Well that's good. I love open.

00:49:32:14 - 00:49:56:00
Thomas Angel
We intended it to be a daily beverage, so we wanted to we want it to be something that you could certainly, you know, inserted into your routine. Especially like maybe the way that we always kind of use it as, like for people who are going out there, you know, on a busy schedule and they're picking up, you know, a Starbucks in the morning or a right, you know, a Red bull from the, you know, gas station, whatever.

00:49:56:00 - 00:50:13:11
Thomas Angel
Like people kind of tend to forget how much they're reaching for convenience in their existing routine because people are always like, oh, like I would never spend, you know, five, $5 a day on, you know, coffee or technology. And then you're like, wait, look back in like your last month, you know, look at your credit card record. How many times do you go to Starbucks?

00:50:13:11 - 00:50:20:12
Thomas Angel
How many times do you like, you know, buy that, you know, whatever, rock star or whatever at the gas station. It's like.

00:50:20:14 - 00:50:22:12
Thomas Angel
You know, yeah, just a gas station.

00:50:22:12 - 00:50:40:00
Jessie Ott
It's I know people that just get up and go to the gas station every day. It's just a routine that they it's just something that, they do. It's just part of their. They get up, they got to get in the car and get woken up and get their daily whatever. And, and that's kind of how they start their day.

00:50:40:00 - 00:50:47:16
Jessie Ott
You know, a lot of, workers are out there. That's what they meet there or they start their, their start their day, their.

00:50:47:18 - 00:50:50:16
Thomas Angel
Yeah, absolutely. And it's nothing wrong with it. I mean, I think it's whatever your routine.

00:50:50:16 - 00:50:52:16
Thomas Angel
Oh absolutely not.

00:50:52:18 - 00:51:10:07
Thomas Angel
I think that's where for us it's like just making a better option out there. Right. So instead of something that's going to make you crash and, you know, feel jittery throughout the day, it was like, hey, let's yeah, it's coffee one. So you do get that energy. But you with all those function ingredients, it kind of also helps to give you that sustained energy.

00:51:10:13 - 00:51:16:23
Thomas Angel
So you can have like a nice like, you know, smooth curve as opposed to like, you know, a peak and then a trough.

00:51:17:01 - 00:51:18:23
Thomas Angel
Right.

00:51:19:01 - 00:51:30:05
Thomas Angel
And yeah. And just make it as easy as literally cracking open a can. Right. Instead of going into your kitchen, you know, making coffee, mixing powders like, you know, staining your kitchen counter with turmeric, you know, it's like, yeah.

00:51:30:07 - 00:51:58:23
Jessie Ott
You get your oil, that gross oil you put in there. So this is really, really, really yummy. So I'll tell you, I love coffee, but it doesn't love me. And it's because the high acid content that I just can't drink it anymore. And I'm really sad about it now. My friend, my best friends, her husband in Dallas, they, he took a, old freezer, a deep freeze and turned it into, a kegerator.

00:51:59:01 - 00:51:59:14
Thomas Angel
Yeah.

00:51:59:16 - 00:52:19:11
Jessie Ott
So he'll make he'll make cold brew and put it on nitro. And so they've got cold brew. And when you do it, when you steep it the way you do with cold brew, it's less acid. So I know cold brews and all that's really, really popular. And so in the summertime especially I'll, I'll do stuff like that. But I'm actually I'm at the point where I can't even drink coffee.

00:52:19:12 - 00:52:32:10
Jessie Ott
And so this would actually have the, the opposite effect for me because it's got the gut health in it, which would be healthy, which is really beneficial. So I could totally see where I could, I could easily switch to this.

00:52:32:12 - 00:52:43:06
Thomas Angel
No. Absolute. Absolutely. And you know, we do use cold brew. That's the base of the coffee in, in our latte. And then obviously things like oat milk helps to lower the pH of it as well.

00:52:43:08 - 00:52:44:14
Thomas Angel
Yes. So we.

00:52:44:14 - 00:52:46:17
Jessie Ott
Use oat milk all the time.

00:52:46:19 - 00:53:06:16
Thomas Angel
Yeah, yeah. Or raise the pH level. Right. So making it more basic as opposed to sitting but yeah, you know, that's also but to your point, that's why we then after and kind of speeding up a little bit, we launched the, the mocha, in June of 2021, like the first.

00:53:06:17 - 00:53:07:09
Thomas Angel
That's pretty quick.

00:53:07:13 - 00:53:18:13
Thomas Angel
You know. Oh, yeah. Yeah, we went we went fast. I mean, like, that was the one thing for me was, you know, we did a very first test production run within 45 days of moving to bed.

00:53:18:13 - 00:53:26:04
Jessie Ott
That's amazing. Because you gotta find someone who has the cans. You gotta create the label, you gotta create your logo.

00:53:26:06 - 00:53:49:15
Thomas Angel
I mean, it was it was scrappy, for sure. I mean, we literally had canned a couple thousand cans that we went out just to go and get consumer feedback and, you know, feedback from retailers and distributors. I mean, that was number one thing for me was if we were going to do this, we're going to do it quickly and we were going to do it focused on, you know, is there truly a market need as opposed to, you know, hey, I really like this thing, and I just want to start it because I like it.

00:53:49:15 - 00:54:11:22
Thomas Angel
And I was like, yeah, like we knew going into it was like, if there's not somebody willing to, you know, take money out of their wallet and, you know, pay money for it. And no retailer willing to, you know, make room on their shelf to, you know, to display it. And a distributor that's actually going to put it on their truck to take it to the retailer, like, you know, maybe it's just a hobby that, so yeah.

00:54:11:22 - 00:54:27:10
Thomas Angel
So we did a really quick test production run, got enough, you know, confidence that we then figured out, okay, how do we actually, like, commercially produce this? We did our first commercial production run in May, launching into market in June. And that was one of the, you know, kind of the feedback that we're getting was people were like, oh, like, I really love it.

00:54:27:10 - 00:54:42:19
Thomas Angel
Like it's amazing, but like, I'm really trying to cut down on coffee or like, you know, hey, like, you know, I, you know, I like everything you're putting in there, but, like, I just I'm not a huge fan of the flavor of coffee. And obviously, you know, smaller percentage, but big enough where we're hearing it again and again.

00:54:42:19 - 00:54:46:13
Thomas Angel
And it was like, well, why don't we offer some different options?

00:54:46:15 - 00:54:48:14
Thomas Angel
Yes. So let's try one.

00:54:48:16 - 00:54:55:05
Thomas Angel
Yeah. So I would move to the next. So we launched a chai and a matcha black tea.

00:54:55:07 - 00:54:56:11
Thomas Angel
Okay. Yeah.

00:54:56:13 - 00:55:00:20
Thomas Angel
So try black tea. And.

00:55:00:22 - 00:55:02:11
Thomas Angel
Make it again. Yeah.

00:55:02:13 - 00:55:03:23
Thomas Angel
Yeah. Give it a shake.

00:55:04:01 - 00:55:06:14
Jessie Ott
So weird.

00:55:06:16 - 00:55:09:04
Thomas Angel
Yeah.

00:55:09:06 - 00:55:16:20
Thomas Angel
Well, part of the reason why we, we tell people to shake it is we do a nitro infusion into the can. So when we.

00:55:16:21 - 00:55:20:00
Thomas Angel
Get it, that's perfect. So, yeah, it just.

00:55:20:02 - 00:55:23:00
Jessie Ott
Same nice color.

00:55:23:02 - 00:55:47:15
Thomas Angel
Nice and creamy and creamy. Yeah. And that's because the nitrogen, it helps, you know, it's a condensed gas. So when you get it through the liquid, just like a, like a Guinness or anything like that, it gives it that nice mouthfeel, which for us then enables us to use an oat milk with no palm oils or wheat binders, because we know we can get that creaminess from the nitrogen, as opposed to stuff that.

00:55:47:15 - 00:55:54:22
Thomas Angel
Yeah, you've got to be put like some of the major oat milk brands, you know, put into their stuff just to make it creamy.

00:55:55:00 - 00:56:06:23
Jessie Ott
Yeah. This smells really, really, really yummy. And look at the the foamy top. I mean, that's the nitro, right? And then part of the oat milk, I guess.

00:56:07:01 - 00:56:10:07
Thomas Angel
Is the nitrogen. It kind of gives a nice little head.

00:56:10:09 - 00:56:12:03
Thomas Angel


00:56:12:05 - 00:56:14:23
Jessie Ott
That is really good.

00:56:15:01 - 00:56:23:04
Thomas Angel
Yeah. We used a little bit of little coconut. So that's kind of like a little flavor twist in the, in our chai.

00:56:23:06 - 00:56:28:20
Jessie Ott
Okay. So that would be the only difference then is coconut versus the cocoa.

00:56:28:22 - 00:56:47:05
Thomas Angel
Exactly. So with each of them we wanted to and you'll see with the mochi here in a little bit, but, with each of them, we wanted to have a little bit of a flavor twist. So it wasn't just like a super like, you know, generic run of the mill. You know, if we're gonna be putting all these great ingredients into it, you know, we were like, let's let's make it fun, you know?

00:56:47:05 - 00:56:52:15
Thomas Angel
Let's make it something different. Let's make it something that's like, more than just, the run of the mill.

00:56:52:17 - 00:57:01:01
Jessie Ott
So who is the first big customer? That was, kind of was like a key moment for you guys.

00:57:01:03 - 00:57:13:22
Thomas Angel
Yeah, yeah. So for us, it was a regional chain in Oregon called, Market of Choice. So, we. Oh, thank you, thank you.

00:57:14:00 - 00:57:15:12
Thomas Angel
No. You're not.

00:57:15:14 - 00:57:35:06
Thomas Angel
I'm happy to hear that. Yeah. Marketing choice was our first, major retail account. And, yeah, we got really fortunate they gave us authorization within about a month after launching, and that was really kind of the big sort of, you know, marquee moment for us that was like, okay, if somebody their size.

00:57:35:06 - 00:57:35:11
Thomas Angel
Is a.

00:57:35:11 - 00:57:36:11
Jessie Ott
Single one, right?

00:57:36:16 - 00:57:38:18
Thomas Angel
Just it was just with a single one.

00:57:38:20 - 00:57:40:19
Thomas Angel
Okay.

00:57:40:21 - 00:58:11:16
Thomas Angel
Which then kind of set off a motion. Right. Because, you know, it's like it's a momentum game, right? With CPG as well. Everybody's always asked, okay, what other retail authorizations do you have and how many stores. And, you know, what's your velocity. Their stores. And and so that was our first opportunity to, you know, kind of get that, you know, marquee retailer, especially regionally and, you know, from there it enabled us to get into distribution, which then enabled us to get more accounts and kind of just sort of created the ball rolling effect.

00:58:11:17 - 00:58:14:09
Thomas Angel
You it just takes one. Yeah.

00:58:14:11 - 00:58:27:13
Thomas Angel
100%, 100% and. Yeah. And you know, through that that was kind of the confidence to be like okay. Like by that point we already had like a roadmap of product development, right, of where we wanted to go as a company.

00:58:27:15 - 00:58:28:21
Thomas Angel
Right.

00:58:28:23 - 00:58:46:03
Thomas Angel
And that was one of those moments where it started to give us the confidence of, okay, yeah, this is this is something that like is we're starting to double down on right start to invest more into it, start to, you know, realize that full vision that we had sort of, set out to, to create.

00:58:46:05 - 00:58:50:09
Jessie Ott
So when did the next flavor come.

00:58:50:11 - 00:58:56:23
Thomas Angel
So we did, the march in the chai December of that year. December of 2021.

00:58:57:01 - 00:58:59:09
Thomas Angel
Okay. So super fast like.

00:58:59:11 - 00:59:21:17
Thomas Angel
This, we're going to we're going to do it, and yeah. And that was right around the time to that we, we finalized our, our first major distribution agreement, in the Pacific Northwest, with a large distributor. Started to also, you know, put ourselves out there beyond regionally.

00:59:21:19 - 00:59:22:02
Thomas Angel
No, it.

00:59:22:07 - 00:59:22:21
Thomas Angel
Was.

00:59:23:03 - 00:59:26:19
Jessie Ott
For grocery or for.

00:59:26:21 - 00:59:40:09
Thomas Angel
Yeah, yeah. So it was a Dswd, Columbia Distributing, which, you know, this is part of the, the world that we live in with having CBD in our products.

00:59:40:11 - 00:59:40:19
Thomas Angel
Right?

00:59:40:19 - 00:59:52:04
Thomas Angel
We don't have access to, like, an Unifi, like a traditional, you know, natural product distributors. So all of our or the majority of our, distributors are like alcohol distributors.

00:59:52:06 - 00:59:58:21
Jessie Ott
Oh, they are okay. I was wondering if that was the case. So. And that's because it's got the CBD in it.

00:59:58:23 - 01:00:20:07
Thomas Angel
Yeah. Yeah, they've been the ones that have been able to, you know, sort of have the risk tolerance, which is kind of crazy to think that they would think there's retailers but just, you know, have the ones that have, you know, been willing to go out and take the bet on it. But that sort of changed. There's definitely more kind of traction, you know, happening, with some other distributors, many even retailers.

01:00:20:09 - 01:00:42:08
Thomas Angel
But yeah, the kind of the big market moment for us then, you know, going into 2022 was getting a sample request from from Sprouts Farmers Markets. That was actually right around this time last year. And, you know, kind of came out of the blue. And, you know, everyone's when you get kind of those things and you're like, all right, well, like amazing.

01:00:42:08 - 01:00:45:11
Thomas Angel
That'd be awesome if that happened. But it's probably not going to happen, you know, like, right.

01:00:45:11 - 01:00:46:12
Thomas Angel
For sure. Yeah.

01:00:46:12 - 01:01:09:21
Thomas Angel
We we've only been on market for like six months. Like there's, there's no way that, you know, somebody like sprouts would, you know, would, would bring out our products and they did like, you know, within a month, after sending samples, I got a call from from Phoenix. I was like, Like, we have one friend in Phoenix, but I had their number saved in my phone, so he's calling me, and, yeah, it was sprouts.

01:01:09:21 - 01:01:18:09
Thomas Angel
And they were like, hey, yeah, we tried your stuff and we really like it. And yeah, you guys want to, like, come on board. And I was like, absolutely.

01:01:18:11 - 01:01:18:19
Thomas Angel
Yeah.

01:01:19:00 - 01:01:20:15
Jessie Ott
The next flight out.

01:01:20:17 - 01:01:23:01
Thomas Angel
Yeah. So yeah.

01:01:23:02 - 01:01:25:03
Thomas Angel
So you have these three step.

01:01:25:03 - 01:01:26:12
Thomas Angel
Change for us.

01:01:26:14 - 01:01:28:08
Jessie Ott
I'm sorry. Go ahead. Wait.

01:01:28:10 - 01:01:36:13
Thomas Angel
No, no, I'm just, saying that that was like, kind of the next sort of like, you know, when you think about, like, the step change, absolute growth. That's huge. Like, that's.

01:01:36:14 - 01:01:38:05
Thomas Angel
Well.

01:01:38:07 - 01:01:43:09
Jessie Ott
So how many, how many locations did they bring in, bring it in to then?

01:01:43:11 - 01:02:01:04
Thomas Angel
At the time, it was funny because initially it was just going to be Colorado. But they were in process of for the first time, bringing CBD Comestibles outside of Colorado. They were like, oh, yeah. Well, you know, we'll start you in Colorado and, you know, maybe then we'll bring you outside. And I was like, well, are you doing CBD outside of Colorado?

01:02:01:04 - 01:02:23:01
Thomas Angel
And they're like, well, yeah, well, you know, we're actually going to start this July. We're going to start doing it in nine states. And, you know, a little under 200 stores, about half of the total number of stores that they have. And I was like, oh, could we like just go ahead and do that? And they were like, well, yeah, I guess you can like and so I mean, that's the power to do it.

01:02:23:03 - 01:02:23:10
Thomas Angel
It's like.

01:02:23:10 - 01:02:24:21
Thomas Angel
The easiest.

01:02:24:23 - 01:02:27:07
Jessie Ott
Like conversation ever.

01:02:27:09 - 01:02:44:18
Thomas Angel
Yeah, I mean sprouts I mean yeah God bless them. They're they're amazing. They're an awesome partner. Really easy. Yeah. But but yeah. So we, we ended up launching in July and I think started with like 170, 172 stores. It's grown a little bit since then.

01:02:44:20 - 01:02:47:19
Thomas Angel
But they have all three flavors.

01:02:47:21 - 01:02:51:06
Thomas Angel
They do? Yeah. They they brought on all three of the Latin flavors.

01:02:51:08 - 01:02:53:06
Thomas Angel
Okay.

01:02:53:08 - 01:02:57:18
Thomas Angel
And, yeah, that was, that was that was a huge moment for us. Obviously.

01:02:57:20 - 01:03:00:21
Jessie Ott
So how many states are you in now, then?

01:03:00:23 - 01:03:29:11
Thomas Angel
So we're in I think we're in 14 now. Okay. Memory serves me correct from the last, pot over that we got, but, yeah, primarily concentrated on West Coast. Like, that's where we have the biggest concentration. And then obviously sprouts and places like Texas and Florida. We've been able to, you know, leverage the density of those accounts into getting some more, you know, chains and, you know, small, independent, you know, grocers and retailers as well.

01:03:29:13 - 01:03:35:09
Jessie Ott
Oh, that's great. All right. The suspense is killing me. Let's get to this third one.

01:03:35:11 - 01:03:49:15
Thomas Angel
Yeah, yeah. So so the matcha, this is the most polarizing one of the lattes. Is it? In general? It's one of those things where, like, I don't know how to like. I think the most honest way to say is people either love it or hate it.

01:03:49:17 - 01:03:49:23
Thomas Angel
Right.

01:03:50:04 - 01:03:53:01
Jessie Ott
Let's let's see if I love it or hate it.

01:03:53:03 - 01:03:55:02
Thomas Angel
It's okay. If you hate it, it's okay to. Right?

01:03:55:04 - 01:03:55:11
Thomas Angel
Okay.

01:03:55:11 - 01:04:01:21
Thomas Angel
Which is what is it? We'll hear. Well, cheers. I won't say anything else until you try it.

01:04:01:23 - 01:04:03:15
Thomas Angel
Cheers.

01:04:03:17 - 01:04:11:02
Jessie Ott
Okay. Also, a dark color. They all kind of look like chocolate milk, don't they?

01:04:11:04 - 01:04:12:12
Thomas Angel
Yeah, yeah. Very creamy.

01:04:12:12 - 01:04:13:18
Thomas Angel
Very. Yeah.

01:04:13:20 - 01:04:24:06
Jessie Ott
Makes me very happy. Okay. Yeah. I could see the polarizing smell. It's definitely a I would say strong, but it's pleasant. It's lovely.

01:04:24:08 - 01:04:27:06
Thomas Angel
It's like coconut.

01:04:27:07 - 01:04:29:21
Thomas Angel
A little bit. Yeah. Yeah yeah.

01:04:29:23 - 01:04:30:21
Thomas Angel
Yeah.

01:04:30:23 - 01:04:40:15
Jessie Ott
That's exactly what I would expect it to taste like. It's awesome okay. No I really like it. So what's this? This sixth ingredient that's different.

01:04:40:17 - 01:04:42:00
Thomas Angel
Hand-carved on.

01:04:42:02 - 01:04:43:14
Jessie Ott
Panda.

01:04:43:15 - 01:05:07:01
Thomas Angel
So that's how you get panda in. Panda on whatever. It's a it's a leaf from Southeast Asia. That has a lot of flavor qualities to, like a taro, you know, a little bit of a coconut, vanilla. Like, it's sometimes called, like the vanilla of Asia. It's high in antioxidants as well. But for us, it's just it's is.

01:05:07:03 - 01:05:25:05
Thomas Angel
Yeah. As much as the whole green tea leaf that's finely ground. Right. So you get not only all those health benefits, but you get a lot of the, the earthiness right of the to eat bitter. And so that's why for a lot of times like matcha, you know, and we're matcha fans but like it can be a little bit too powerful.

01:05:25:05 - 01:05:36:16
Thomas Angel
It could be a little too strong. So that's why we added the pond on into it, because it kind of just gives it a nice little softness to it. Right? So kind of, rounds out some of those really old sharp edges.

01:05:36:18 - 01:05:41:11
Jessie Ott
Creamy kind of texture to it, which is the oatmilk I guess.

01:05:41:13 - 01:05:48:19
Thomas Angel
Exactly. Well, and also the majority of the matcha. Helps to aid some of that creaminess because it's a real sort of fine powder as well.

01:05:48:21 - 01:05:51:09
Jessie Ott
So why matcha?

01:05:51:11 - 01:06:17:04
Thomas Angel
So it's the perfect in-between between like, like a chai and a coffee. So because you have the whole green tea leaf, you also have a little bit more caffeine. And it's fits right in the middle between the two. So whereas our coffees, around 120mg of caffeine per can, our tries about 30mg of caffeine per can the machine like smack dab in the middle.

01:06:17:04 - 01:06:18:01
Thomas Angel
It's about 75.

01:06:18:01 - 01:06:19:16
Thomas Angel
Yeah. Okay.

01:06:19:18 - 01:06:41:02
Thomas Angel
So, you know, for people who are tea drinkers but want a little bit more, you know, kind of kick to it. And also, once again, people who love matcha love matcha, right? It's one of the things where it's got a very, you know, fervent, you know, audience, and you. Yeah, we're matcha fans. So it was like, cool.

01:06:41:03 - 01:06:46:02
Thomas Angel
Let's, let's provide a cool option out there because we didn't really see that many options. I think partly because it is.

01:06:46:02 - 01:06:47:15
Thomas Angel
No, there.

01:06:47:15 - 01:06:51:14
Jessie Ott
Isn't any I mean, I, I don't they're not very many.

01:06:51:16 - 01:07:04:20
Thomas Angel
Yeah. So you for ready to drink I mean yeah typically you're seeing in coffee shops with people, you know, doing the ceremonial grade matcha which we use a ceremonial grade. It's just it's not made, you know, right in front of you. It's it's an camp.

01:07:04:21 - 01:07:09:17
Jessie Ott
Okay, I got it. So which one is the biggest seller today?

01:07:09:21 - 01:07:20:16
Thomas Angel
Coffee. Coffee for sure. I mean, that's really good. It's also just where, you know, you look at statistics, 63% of U.S. adults drink at least one cup of coffee a day.

01:07:20:18 - 01:07:20:22
Thomas Angel
Yep.

01:07:20:22 - 01:07:25:11
Jessie Ott
Right. And that's what you wanted, right? You wanted to do the coffee every day.

01:07:25:13 - 01:07:26:02
Thomas Angel
Ritual coffee.

01:07:26:02 - 01:07:47:03
Thomas Angel
Exactly, exactly. But at the same time. Right. Like the chai, the matcha, you know, they're they're not that far behind. Obviously, it's a little bit less so in terms of total volume, but yeah, we have people who scribe to our website, like people who order 24 cans at a time of like the machu, the chai. Right. Like it's just like it's so funny to see.

01:07:47:04 - 01:07:57:22
Thomas Angel
Right. It's like it's at like kind of 8020 rule. Right? Where it's like with the machine and chai like 80% of like the revenue that we get off of those lines come from like 20% of the customer.

01:07:58:00 - 01:07:58:20
Thomas Angel
Yep.

01:07:58:22 - 01:08:09:07
Jessie Ott
They're diehards. Yeah, exactly. Okay. So do we want to move on to the this new line that you have.

01:08:09:09 - 01:08:36:19
Thomas Angel
Love to love to you. Yeah. This is work for us. We're seeing you know, the most growth. And you know for us too it's just it's been such a fun journey with so as I kind of mentioned, when we started, obviously the coffee was the genesis of it. But even then in the summer, kind of early fall of 2020, we knew that we wanted to start a functional beverage company, not just like a CBD company or a CBD coffee company.

01:08:36:21 - 01:09:00:17
Thomas Angel
And we wanted it to be like our ethos from day one was, how do we make functional ingredients accessible and delicious? By putting it into your your existing beverage routine. Right. And so, you know, start with the first part of your routine, your, you know, your morning. And at the same time, we were going through kind of our own personal journey, reevaluating our relationship with alcohol.

01:09:00:19 - 01:09:08:23
Thomas Angel
So through like the pandemic and spending quite a few years and, you know, sales and marketing and then also living in China, where, you know, every.

01:09:09:00 - 01:09:11:19
Jessie Ott
Single night and drink with your boss.

01:09:11:21 - 01:09:26:05
Thomas Angel
Yeah. Or the workforce is, you know, it's part of the culture, right? Like, you, you know, you're supposed to do business, you know, sober and then you do business and created because it's like you can like, you know, be trusted, you know, and both, you know, states then, okay, like you're, you're, you know, it's.

01:09:26:11 - 01:09:31:12
Jessie Ott
That's what that meat, that's what they're doing. Oh. That's funny. Okay, I did that.

01:09:31:14 - 01:09:49:18
Thomas Angel
And so, so yeah. So, you know, with this journey of, you know, adding all these function ingredients, one thing that we did at the time was, this, like, kind of like, I don't know if you heard it before. It's called, like, 75 hard, like, you spent 75 days and like, you have to do all these things.

01:09:49:18 - 01:10:08:10
Thomas Angel
And one of it is, you're not supposed to drink any alcohol, okay? So we were like, okay, cool. Like, let's do that. I mean, this would be like a great opportunity for us to kind of reset and like within like 3 or 4 days, like, you know, when, like the evenings would come around, we'd be like, you know, not like, oh, like, I really want to alcohol.

01:10:08:10 - 01:10:12:19
Thomas Angel
But you're like, I want something like, I want something that's like,

01:10:12:21 - 01:10:16:06
Jessie Ott
You know, you you're recapping the day and.

01:10:16:08 - 01:10:16:15
Thomas Angel
Yeah.

01:10:16:19 - 01:10:36:19
Thomas Angel
Yeah. And in a, bubbly water or even, like a kabuki, or like a so like it didn't hit the spot because one of the things where it was like, you know, I just I don't feel like I have that, like, evening ritual. Right? And so we tried things like kava, which you definitely get a feeling from for sure, but it tastes terrible.

01:10:36:19 - 01:10:38:21
Thomas Angel
It is like, terrible.

01:10:38:23 - 01:10:39:13
Jessie Ott
I don't like it.

01:10:39:14 - 01:10:55:08
Thomas Angel
And, you know, so then that's kind of where we started. You know, the second journey, which was. All right, well, what are the things that kind of, helped to take the edge off that are like alcohol, right? And obviously there's things like THC that you know, kind of get you high, but it's like, I don't really know.

01:10:55:08 - 01:10:57:17
Thomas Angel
So I want to be high, right? I want to be like.

01:10:57:19 - 01:10:58:23
Thomas Angel
I just want to be.

01:10:59:00 - 01:11:01:16
Thomas Angel
I don't want to be high. I just want to be, like, relaxed.

01:11:01:18 - 01:11:02:22
Thomas Angel
Yeah.

01:11:02:23 - 01:11:25:12
Thomas Angel
So that kind of, you know, set us on the journey of learning about things like nootropics, like these amino acids and, you know, other things that kind of help to take the edge off. So right around the same time we started to formulate these things in our own, you know, kitchen. And then summer of last year, summer 2022, we got the confidence of, okay, we've launched the, you know, the three lattes.

01:11:25:12 - 01:11:29:07
Thomas Angel
We got those out of distribution.

01:11:29:09 - 01:11:55:02
Thomas Angel
We want this product for ourselves. So we did our very first production run of, you know, what we call our sunset vibes. So they're a sparkling white tea base that we use in. Yeah. So we use real fruit juices. And then. Yeah. Nootropics. So we use Gaba, five HTP l-theanine in addition to quarter ceps and CBD to basically.

01:11:55:04 - 01:11:57:08
Jessie Ott
I take that because of Covid.

01:11:57:10 - 01:12:21:16
Thomas Angel
Yeah, yeah. Well, you know, kind of similar to the. Yeah. The ethos we wanted a real ingredient. So with the blue Hawaiian, we wanted that kind of fun, you know, electric blue without having to use food coloring. Right. Wrong dyes or, you know, artificial things. So blue spirulina, it's, great, you know, functional ingredient and also gives it that great blue color.

01:12:21:18 - 01:12:27:00
Jessie Ott
I didn't know that. I thought it was. I thought it was green. Maybe they mixed balina with other things.

01:12:27:02 - 01:12:31:07
Thomas Angel
Nice. I mean, it's definitely I would say it's aquamarine, teal.

01:12:31:09 - 01:12:32:03
Jessie Ott
Ooh, pretty.

01:12:32:03 - 01:12:32:10
Thomas Angel
So you'll.

01:12:32:10 - 01:12:33:02
Thomas Angel
See.

01:12:33:04 - 01:12:33:20
Jessie Ott
Like the see.

01:12:33:20 - 01:12:34:22
Thomas Angel
Okay. Yeah.

01:12:34:22 - 01:12:36:22
Thomas Angel
You'll see when you open it and you pour it out.

01:12:37:00 - 01:12:38:21
Jessie Ott
Let's do this thing.

01:12:38:23 - 01:12:42:06
Thomas Angel
But, Yes. No no no no, you don't have to shake this one.

01:12:42:10 - 01:12:43:12
Jessie Ott
Don't shake this one. It's got.

01:12:43:12 - 01:12:44:11
Thomas Angel
Bubbles.

01:12:44:13 - 01:12:48:21
Thomas Angel
Yeah. It's got a little bit of carbonation to it.

01:12:48:23 - 01:12:51:16
Thomas Angel
Okay. Cheers. Yeah.

01:12:51:16 - 01:12:54:19
Jessie Ott
Okay. Yes. Cheers. Yummy.

01:12:54:21 - 01:13:12:21
Thomas Angel
So yeah. So the blue line is pineapple green. Curacao, which traditionally is a bitter orange liqueur. Since we're using a nonalcoholic we're using basically like a combination of bitter orange flavors and, orange juice.

01:13:12:23 - 01:13:13:07
Thomas Angel
Definitely.

01:13:13:08 - 01:13:17:06
Thomas Angel
Spirulina, but yeah, it should be a.

01:13:17:08 - 01:13:19:20
Jessie Ott
Healthy, like, earthy kind of.

01:13:19:22 - 01:13:23:05
Thomas Angel
The spirulina definitely has a little bit of,

01:13:23:07 - 01:13:24:02
Jessie Ott
In the pineapple.

01:13:24:03 - 01:13:24:19
Thomas Angel
And everything, but.

01:13:24:21 - 01:13:34:21
Jessie Ott
Really. Yeah, I love pineapple. I've been eating it like crazy since I've been down with Covid.

01:13:34:23 - 01:13:37:05
Jessie Ott
Oh, that's refreshing.

01:13:37:07 - 01:13:40:06
Thomas Angel
Oh I love the citrus.

01:13:40:08 - 01:13:42:01
Thomas Angel
And it's you know it's 40 calories.

01:13:42:01 - 01:13:56:15
Jessie Ott
Not sweet like you'd expect it to be. It's not sweet. It's just. Yeah it's got a little bubbles to it. So I don't know if you, it's kind of hard to see because I've got my light on. But there's some bubbles in there.

01:13:56:17 - 01:14:06:21
Thomas Angel
Yeah. Lightly carbonated you know enough to give it a little bit of body but not like you know a Lacroix or a doctor Pepper where it's like, you know, making your, your stomach bubble.

01:14:06:23 - 01:14:07:08
Thomas Angel
Right.

01:14:07:09 - 01:14:26:01
Jessie Ott
But it's also, gosh, it's, it's like a nice combination of both pineapple and orange because when I finish it in the aft, like, kind of like the, the aftertaste is very, almost orange juice, like, it's so wild. It's so refreshing and yummy. Like you.

01:14:26:05 - 01:14:27:02
Thomas Angel
Thank you. I appreciate that.

01:14:27:08 - 01:14:31:13
Jessie Ott
You can even have this for breakfast.

01:14:31:15 - 01:14:32:16
Thomas Angel
Yeah. Why not? Why not?

01:14:32:19 - 01:14:34:18
Thomas Angel
What's your pancake jam?

01:14:34:20 - 01:14:42:19
Jessie Ott
And, bacon. So how do you typically serve this? And you just pour it over ice? Or do you put fruit with it or.

01:14:42:21 - 01:15:11:20
Thomas Angel
Yeah. I mean, you know, obviously, like with all the products, we want it to be accessible from a canned. So that way like you're like especially with this line, we've seen huge growth with like the on premise. Right. So bars, restaurants, concert venues, very first account last summer was the Live Nation, venue in central Oregon. So you're out at a concert and it's a Tuesday night and you.

01:15:11:20 - 01:15:28:07
Thomas Angel
Yeah. Say maybe you had a beer or a cocktail, but, you know, there's two hours after the concert and you're like, wow. You know, I got meetings at 630 tomorrow morning. I'm not really trying to, you know, feel hung over, have something that, you know, has that social occasion. Right. Or for the people who just don't want to drink at all.

01:15:28:07 - 01:15:45:17
Thomas Angel
Right, but they don't necessarily want a soda or, you know, or a this is the thing that we heard a lot, too, is, is our sort of journey is, you know, when we're not drinking, like, I'm not a big beer fan to begin with, which is kind of sacrilegious because we live in Beer Town USA. Right? Five breweries in bend.

01:15:45:21 - 01:16:05:09
Thomas Angel
Yeah. But it's like if I'm not drinking alcohol, like, I don't necessarily want a nonalcoholic beer. And that's typically like the options that you see at these places, which is great. I mean, like athletic brewing and yeah, all these things are are great options. But like just because you're not drinking doesn't assume that you drink beer when you were drinking, you know.

01:16:05:11 - 01:16:07:13
Thomas Angel
And yeah, it's.

01:16:07:13 - 01:16:36:18
Jessie Ott
A it seems to be a thing. I my last week's guest he's Irish and he went back to two weddings in Ireland and both weddings offered, a nonalcoholic beer on, on tap, I think he said. And I saw it on the news. We are GMA people and it's a thing. What? I guess they're expecting 4% of all weddings this year to have to be just be 100% nonalcoholic for whatever the reason might be, which is great.

01:16:36:18 - 01:16:55:03
Jessie Ott
I think it's I think it's, awesome. You know, it's more accepted. And, you know, I had another, person on this podcast. Max Breen from Liter Brewing, once Athletic, came out and he saw that they could do it. It tastes good. He's like, I'm on all on board because he's been brewing on and off for 17 years.

01:16:55:03 - 01:17:27:09
Jessie Ott
So it's a thing. And what's interesting too is a lot of people, even Bill Miller with mocktails, beverages, they're not saying it's a substitute, but you could just have one in between. Like if you want a, a beer or a moderate bill, and then you take a rest and you have one and you know, which I think is a great idea because, you know, I mean, you know, maybe you don't want to drink, you know, all day or all night or like you said at the concert, because it's I don't know if it's, I don't know what's going on.

01:17:27:09 - 01:17:32:05
Jessie Ott
Maybe, you know, in our 20s, we could we could do whatever we want and get up and go to work the next day.

01:17:32:05 - 01:17:33:23
Thomas Angel
But sure, can't do.

01:17:33:23 - 01:17:35:01
Jessie Ott
It anymore, you know?

01:17:35:04 - 01:17:36:22
Thomas Angel
Yeah. No, no, I think it's.

01:17:36:22 - 01:17:54:13
Thomas Angel
Just people, you know, reevaluating their, you know, their own health. Right? You know, being conscious about. And that's the number thing that we always tell people is just, you know, just be conscious about like what you put in your body about, you know, how you live your life and, you know, progress isn't made through like large, wide, sweeping changes.

01:17:54:13 - 01:17:56:02
Thomas Angel
It's usually incrementally.

01:17:56:04 - 01:17:57:00
Thomas Angel
Yeah.

01:17:57:02 - 01:18:19:03
Thomas Angel
And that's where 100%. Right. I mean, of the people that are buying, you know, nonalcoholic products, 77 is our 70% of them are people who still consume alcohol. Right, right. So, I mean, certainly there's a whole audience of people who are, you know, sober and, you know, it's you talk to them and it's like game changing. They have so many amazing, you know, products.

01:18:19:05 - 01:18:37:08
Thomas Angel
But the reality is, is that the majority of people who are buying these things are people who are to your point, they're like, you know, I'll have like a beer and then I'll switch over, right? You know, it's like it's just finding better options to moderate. So that way, you know, you're not feeling like, well, I'm out of the bar and I'm having a meeting or a happy hour.

01:18:37:08 - 01:18:54:15
Thomas Angel
It's like my only option is, is to keep drinking. It's like, oh, it's like it's come to the point now where it's, you know, that social element of it, right? That social validation, has probably been the biggest piece with these. You know, types of products is, you know, you hold this right in your hand. It doesn't look like you're holding like a soda or.

01:18:54:15 - 01:18:54:23
Thomas Angel
Right.

01:18:54:23 - 01:19:02:00
Thomas Angel
You know. Oh. Sparkling water. Right. It looks like you're holding like a seltzer or like a can cocktail.

01:19:02:02 - 01:19:02:07
Thomas Angel
Okay.

01:19:02:09 - 01:19:19:10
Thomas Angel
Did that alone just kind of like, gives the people, like, the confidence of, like. Oh, yeah. Like, I can hang out and other people can be drinking, but I don't have to. And I don't have to feel that, like, social stigma, you know, being the, you know, the outsider or the right one. It's like, oh, why are you drinking water?

01:19:19:10 - 01:19:22:18
Thomas Angel
Why are you drinking soda or whatever?

01:19:22:20 - 01:19:51:02
Jessie Ott
Yep. Yeah. That kind of, meant I guess it's kind of like an an an attitude or a thought process that is really kind of not a part of our culture anymore. It's got I mean, it's just so accepted now, which is, which is great because if you're, you know, you don't want to drink or it's a lifestyle, choice, or if you're a woman trying to get pregnant or whatever the case may be, it's no longer an issue.

01:19:51:02 - 01:20:13:14
Jessie Ott
It's just like, okay, all right. Cheers. You know, it's not it's not a thing anymore. And I just I love that I think that was certainly, a definite benefit to, you know, this whole, you know, infusion of products that are, you're able to be in a bar, you're able to be, you know, with friends at a picnic or, you know, a wedding.

01:20:13:16 - 01:20:19:08
Jessie Ott
I mean, if you're drinking, if you're if you're having a draft beer and there's no alcohol and nobody knows.

01:20:19:10 - 01:20:22:22
Thomas Angel
Yeah, yeah, no one cares for sure.

01:20:23:00 - 01:20:28:01
Thomas Angel
Nobody cares exactly to the point where it's it's like it's that social acceptance.

01:20:28:03 - 01:20:30:01
Thomas Angel
Yeah. Look, if they could in.

01:20:30:01 - 01:20:32:08
Jessie Ott
Ireland, you could do it anywhere, right?

01:20:32:10 - 01:20:50:17
Thomas Angel
And true. True. Very true. But, you know, we want to take a step further, too, right? Because it was like, you know, for us, in our personal experience, it was like, okay, well, you know, how do we still get that, that taking the edge off, feeling like, how do we still get that, like kind of relaxation? Yeah.

01:20:50:19 - 01:21:07:13
Thomas Angel
Because, you know, once again, it's like you may not want to be drinking, but part of that evening ritual just as much as, like the morning where it's like, you want the energy, you want the focus, you want, like, you know, all these things to kind of get you through the day. We still wanted something that was like, how do we get that unwind?

01:21:07:13 - 01:21:28:02
Thomas Angel
And that's where for us it was like, okay, well, not only is it like tastes like a cocktail look like a cocktail. We want it to have those similar just unwind, you know, effects of a cocktail. So yeah, that's where for us, it's like our full differentiation is not drunk, not high, but, like, just get that unwind.

01:21:28:04 - 01:21:45:16
Jessie Ott
Just chill. Yep. That's it. That's the one thing too, is, you know, we're when we're all done with work and we come in together as a family or whatever, it's like, okay, let's just have a glass of wine together. Let's just chill out. How is your day? Sure. So it makes perfect sense. And I really like that as an alternative because.

01:21:45:18 - 01:21:46:19
Thomas Angel


01:21:46:20 - 01:22:02:01
Jessie Ott
You know, the sugar that's involved, you know, like I mentioned with coffee and the acid, and then you have too much of that. It creates sort of this problem, this systemic problem. So to have that kind of relaxing effect, would be the perfect alternative.

01:22:02:03 - 01:22:16:08
Thomas Angel
That's that's our hope. And, you know, kind of to, you know, further go on that idea of like, compounding effects, the way that we saw it was like kind of get yourself into a vicious cycle where, you know, people, you know, they have one too many drinks and a happy hour.

01:22:16:10 - 01:22:16:16
Thomas Angel
Yep.

01:22:16:22 - 01:22:35:20
Thomas Angel
They wake up groggy the next morning, too. They drink one too many coffees throughout the day just to kind of get through the day. So then they're amped up. So then, you know, you have to, like, wine yourself back down or down. One too many like glasses of wine and then it's like it's a really vicious cycle that we, you know, it's on our own routine where it was like, hey, like, if you can start your day off, right?

01:22:35:20 - 01:22:49:12
Thomas Angel
Like, I mean, you asked earlier, like, you know, what's our recommendation? Like, I truthfully like we hope that people only have to drink one of our lattes. Like, which is probably not the right thing to say as, like a CEO of a company where you're like, you know, you should drink.

01:22:49:14 - 01:22:51:14
Thomas Angel
But it's true. But no, but.

01:22:51:17 - 01:23:07:17
Thomas Angel
But but truly, like, it's like you should only have to have one of them to get through your whole day. Have the energy and the focus that you need to, you know, get through your workday and then. Yeah, and then like for the evening unwind like have this that replaces the need for the alcohol or maybe the need to over consume alcohol.

01:23:07:19 - 01:23:31:20
Thomas Angel
So that you wake up, you know, feeling refreshed enough that you only need to have, you know, maybe one of our lattes or one cup of coffee or one, you know, a cup of tea or whatever it may be. So, I mean, like, that's where for us is like, obviously we hope, people are buying our products and enjoying our products, but we hope it also kind of helps them in their pursuit of living a better life.

01:23:31:22 - 01:23:33:00
Thomas Angel
Right?

01:23:33:02 - 01:23:39:11
Thomas Angel
Just make those things a little bit easier. Right? Those those small little choices you yeah. Small have that compounding effect.

01:23:39:13 - 01:23:43:19
Jessie Ott
Yeah. Absolutely. So do we want to try another flavor.

01:23:43:21 - 01:23:46:00
Thomas Angel
So you want to try the the crowd favorite.

01:23:46:00 - 01:23:47:19
Thomas Angel
Please I love the.

01:23:47:20 - 01:24:05:14
Thomas Angel
Paloma has created a, you know a whole life of its own. Yeah. This is the one that was the most difficult for us to formulate. It was the one that I was the most excited about. But it was really, really hard. It has become, you know, by far the most popular.

01:24:05:16 - 01:24:07:00
Thomas Angel
Has it. So it's a.

01:24:07:02 - 01:24:12:15
Thomas Angel
It's a ruby red grapefruit. Oh. With color, with basil.

01:24:12:17 - 01:24:19:01
Jessie Ott
I love basil. It makes me want to go out in a garden and throw some in there. Well, I can smell it already.

01:24:19:03 - 01:24:21:08
Thomas Angel


01:24:21:10 - 01:24:35:11
Jessie Ott
Yeah. You can definitely smell some of that basil. Definitely. You get the ruby, the ruby red for sure. It's in that more pungent kind of flavor to it.

01:24:35:13 - 01:24:45:08
Jessie Ott
And then you got the little bubbles and that's so smooth. Wow. That is smooth. Wow wow that is really fun.

01:24:45:10 - 01:24:46:09
Thomas Angel
It's you.

01:24:46:10 - 01:25:06:00
Jessie Ott
It's really it's it's like, it's just so light and simple and, refreshing. I could totally see sitting on our lanai out here, you know, after work and just kind of chilling out, and I'd probably put some fruit in there, little, like the orange, orange slice and.

01:25:06:02 - 01:25:06:17
Thomas Angel
Yeah, sure.

01:25:06:18 - 01:25:11:03
Jessie Ott
Of course, I'd go to the garden and throw a bunch basil in there because I love basil.

01:25:11:05 - 01:25:35:11
Thomas Angel
Yeah, yeah. Well, you know, I think for us it's like it's just that really nice citrus, a little bit of sweet. And that's a nice thing with that. The, the ruby red. It's a sweeter, less bitter grapefruit than a pink grapefruit. And then that like just a little herbal kiss, right. Like it doesn't like, overpower. It just gives a nice sort of, like, fresh, you know, kick to the to the mouthfeel.

01:25:35:13 - 01:25:42:13
Jessie Ott
The citrus is, making my mouth water, like, oh, I need more. Oh, I need more. Where is that? I want some.

01:25:42:13 - 01:25:44:23
Thomas Angel
More.

01:25:45:01 - 01:25:50:03
Jessie Ott
It really does. It's it's awesome. But, I mean, I love citrus.

01:25:50:05 - 01:25:52:01
Thomas Angel
Yeah. No, no, I thank you. I mean, it.

01:25:52:05 - 01:25:53:20
Thomas Angel
Is a,

01:25:53:22 - 01:26:03:23
Thomas Angel
Yeah, I just it's it's for us. It's been, it's we were the most worried about it just because, you know grapefruit can be really polarizing as well. Right. Some people are like, oh, I don't like grapefruit. Grapefruit.

01:26:03:23 - 01:26:06:04
Thomas Angel
Stupid. Very true.

01:26:06:06 - 01:26:30:15
Thomas Angel
And you know, I always tell people, hey, try it, just try it. You know, if you don't like it, it's okay. But this is the one where it's like like I said, it's it's created its own life. Because once people realize that they like it, they go crazy. Like, we have, like, accounts that will go through, you know, a whole case and like a 24 pack case in like an evening, you know, and like, like it'll be like for people who are drinking it.

01:26:30:15 - 01:26:31:12
Thomas Angel
Right, right.

01:26:31:14 - 01:26:44:14
Thomas Angel
They'll drink like 4 or 5 of them. And yeah, I mean, I think it's, it's one of things where it surprises people how refreshing it is. You know, how much it really it kind of feels like a cocktail, right? Like it's got that sort of.

01:26:44:15 - 01:26:59:19
Jessie Ott
This is definitely my favorite of all. I mean, this is so there's so different and, I could see where people would want to put vodka. I mean, I, I'd go so far as to say you could put some bourbon in here and it'd be awesome.

01:26:59:21 - 01:27:00:02
Thomas Angel
Which.

01:27:00:02 - 01:27:04:12
Thomas Angel
Is another. I may have to try that after this so we don't. Yeah.

01:27:04:18 - 01:27:22:12
Thomas Angel
I mean that's a that's another thing that, you know, we say with it is, is like, you know, we intended to be, you know, like a nonalcoholic option. But if you want to pour a little bit of, you know, tequila or mezcal or whiskey or vodka or whatever you want it to it, like go for it. Like, you know, you know yourself.

01:27:22:12 - 01:27:29:15
Thomas Angel
And if that's what you know, your enjoyment is like, who are we to say that, you know, oh, you shouldn't do that.

01:27:29:17 - 01:27:36:12
Jessie Ott
Yeah. You can't tell me not to put bourbon in there.

01:27:36:14 - 01:27:40:23
Thomas Angel
Well, let me know how that goes. I'm curious. I, I'm pretty way putting bourbon in the Paloma.

01:27:41:01 - 01:27:43:06
Jessie Ott
I don't know why. It just inspired me.

01:27:43:08 - 01:27:49:19
Thomas Angel
Yeah, I can see that. Like, what's the brown derby? Is, bourbon and grapefruit juice cocktail.

01:27:49:21 - 01:27:54:07
Jessie Ott
I don't know, but it sounds good.

01:27:54:09 - 01:28:10:02
Jessie Ott
I will, I'll, I'll videotape myself or something to send it to you so you can see my reaction, because I think it's going to be fun. I, I absolutely you're right. That is that is that is that is on the money. I really like that one.

01:28:10:04 - 01:28:11:06
Thomas Angel
Thank you I appreciate it.

01:28:11:06 - 01:28:12:15
Thomas Angel
Yeah that's good. Okay.

01:28:12:16 - 01:28:13:17
Thomas Angel
You want to try the last one.

01:28:13:19 - 01:28:16:03
Jessie Ott
Yeah. Last one okay. What do we got here.

01:28:16:05 - 01:28:19:08
Thomas Angel
So this is our version of, a Moscow mule. We call it amount.

01:28:19:09 - 01:28:20:08
Thomas Angel
Okay.

01:28:20:10 - 01:28:24:21
Thomas Angel
Once again, another kind of ode to, you know, to our mountain setting.

01:28:24:23 - 01:28:25:20
Thomas Angel
Okay.

01:28:25:22 - 01:28:48:01
Thomas Angel
And then. Yeah, partly so we use a garden mint in it as well to kind of get some of that herbal. Nice. But the way that it's, interacting with, the ginger, it almost gives it kind of like a piney quality. So it kind of helps to reinforce that sort of mountain, you know, that mountain smell, that sort of mountain.

01:28:48:04 - 01:28:53:02
Thomas Angel
Yeah. Flavor to it. So, yeah, that's what I'm talking about. You know.

01:28:53:04 - 01:29:03:00
Jessie Ott
That, in Florida we have a lot of pine trees. I know it sounds strange, but there's pine cones all over the place. And if you smell those trees, this is what it smells like.

01:29:03:02 - 01:29:05:11
Thomas Angel


01:29:05:13 - 01:29:13:13
Jessie Ott
Yeah. And it's got that spice to it I love ginger I make my own ginger ale all the time. I love it so much.

01:29:13:15 - 01:29:15:04
Thomas Angel
Yeah. Cause I don't want the sugar.

01:29:15:05 - 01:29:17:10
Jessie Ott
Everything has so much sugar in it.

01:29:17:12 - 01:29:36:12
Thomas Angel
Exactly. Which is, you know the one thing with with all our beverages, including our, our evening line, you know, we add some. We put this the other week, and I love how it just makes so much sense to go. You know, sugar inherently is not bad or evil or anything like that. It's just the overuse of it.

01:29:36:14 - 01:29:42:10
Thomas Angel
And the we had to think about it as like salt. It's seasoning. Right? Like you wouldn't like, you know, pour.

01:29:42:10 - 01:29:43:11
Thomas Angel
Good point. That makes.

01:29:43:11 - 01:29:43:21
Jessie Ott
Us feel.

01:29:43:21 - 01:29:48:14
Thomas Angel
Bad. Now I need to cut sugar out of my diet.

01:29:48:16 - 01:30:12:04
Thomas Angel
Well, but but that's what it is like for these, right? Like they're all eight grams of sugar. The majority of that's coming from the fruit juices, you know, only a little bit of added through an organic cane sugar. But especially with like, the mule, like you look at, like the options that are on the marketplace for like, ginger beers or ginger ales, you know, majority of them are like 35 to like 50g of sugar, you know, per, you know, container.

01:30:12:06 - 01:30:30:01
Thomas Angel
And I think because ginger can be polarizing if it's sort of in its raw form would be too spicy, it can be too earthy. For us. It was like, we want to lean into that, bring it like it's yeah, you know, if you really like Ginger, if you like a mule, like you want something with some bite.

01:30:30:03 - 01:30:30:12
Thomas Angel
That's right.

01:30:30:12 - 01:30:40:06
Jessie Ott
That ginger beer is very pungent, you know. In fact, it's even too much for me. I don't care for ginger beer, but I love ginger. It doesn't make any sense, but.

01:30:40:07 - 01:30:41:02
Thomas Angel
Okay.

01:30:41:04 - 01:31:11:13
Jessie Ott
But this doesn't seem to be. This is not over gingery to me, but all these are just lovely and delicate to me. As. Oh, thank you. As a as a combination of flavors because nothing really over empowers the other and they're extremely, well balanced. Whereas I'm not getting when you taste it maybe on the, you know, I can definitely smell the pine, but when you actually taste it, it's just so well balanced and smooth and it's just easy drinking.

01:31:11:15 - 01:31:19:21
Jessie Ott
I can, I can totally I should just do go. I should just try your products for a month and see how I feel at the end of the month.

01:31:19:23 - 01:31:43:23
Thomas Angel
Yeah, I would love it. I know, I mean like, yeah, I mean that's like the thing for us is, you know, we're always, you know, other than like the flavor or like, you know, comments that we get, you know, positive flavor comments. The thing that I always love to hear the most, you know, on the lattes is when people go like, you know, I had one of your lattes and I literally knocked out my to do list, like all those things that I've been just kind of like, you know, putting to the side.

01:31:43:23 - 01:32:02:21
Thomas Angel
Like I went out there and I just, you know, I felt so focused, I felt so clear. And then on the other side of it, it's like when people were like, you're like, you know, hey, like I had like, you know, one of your your sunset vibes, like the Paloma or the mule or the Blue Hawaiian. And I just like, had that deep, like, you know, like that breath.

01:32:02:21 - 01:32:20:22
Thomas Angel
Right? Like that of the day. Like that unwind like the shoulders. Kind of like unclench clenching, you know, it's it's like that's for me is more powerful than you know. And don't get me wrong, I love it when people are like, oh, it's so delicious. Or you know, you know. Right. You know, it's what I was looking for a flavor, but it's the feeling that we're going.

01:32:20:22 - 01:32:21:16
Thomas Angel
For, right?

01:32:21:20 - 01:32:25:08
Jessie Ott
This is an experience.

01:32:25:10 - 01:32:38:03
Jessie Ott
Yeah. That's exactly what you're I mean, you you created these because that's what you wanted. And you want other people to have that exact same experience. And I'm looking for alternatives for that experience because I don't need the sugar.

01:32:38:05 - 01:32:40:19
Thomas Angel
Yeah. No I get you, get you.

01:32:40:21 - 01:32:59:15
Jessie Ott
Yeah. Now these are, these are really good. So where can I get where can people buy these. And by the way, I want to mention the white tea. These are all made with white tea which is my favorite. I love white and green teas. They're my absolute favorite. So where where are these available outside of your website?

01:32:59:17 - 01:33:20:17
Thomas Angel
So right now it's predominantly on the West Coast. Okay. Oregon and Washington, a little bit on the California at this point. But we have some exciting news that I can't quite yet announce that's announcing in the next, you know, month or so here, we've got a new, distributor. That's gonna be bringing that on nationally.

01:33:20:19 - 01:33:25:02
Jessie Ott
Great. Well, let me know what it is when I post your podcast. I'll post it up there.

01:33:25:04 - 01:33:26:20
Thomas Angel
Yeah. So, you know, just great. We'll come.

01:33:26:20 - 01:33:30:13
Jessie Ott
In and watch or listen over time, they can.

01:33:30:15 - 01:33:44:13
Thomas Angel
Check in, but yeah, but yeah, certainly, you know, number one channel right now for us is, is our website, you know, in places that we don't have it in retail. And then also the great thing too is if you go to our website and you go to our store finder, we have an awesome little feature on there.

01:33:44:13 - 01:34:04:09
Thomas Angel
I don't know if you've heard of this called, We stock. It's a company where, you know, they basically like anybody that comes to our website, they don't see like their favorite store or their products, not at that store that they shop at. They can go on there and they can request they could be like, hey, like, you know, I want to see you at the Central Market store down the street from me in Dallas.

01:34:04:10 - 01:34:06:02
Thomas Angel
That is cool to you at.

01:34:06:04 - 01:34:28:17
Thomas Angel
You know, the public store in Florida or whatever it is. And it's really helpful for us because then when we go to, you know, buyer meetings and, you know, category resets, we can take that data to them and say, hey, like, you know, we've had, you know, 300 people say that they want to be at Publix. And, you know, specifically, you know, 30 of them were at this store and 40 of them were at that store.

01:34:28:21 - 01:34:37:23
Thomas Angel
And then it kind of helps us to tell that story of, you know, there's people actually out there that want to see our products at your, you know, at your location.

01:34:38:01 - 01:34:41:08
Jessie Ott
So what is your website for everybody to go to?

01:34:41:08 - 01:34:49:00
Thomas Angel
Yeah. It's, altitude rev.com. So altitude Bev as in, like beverage, dot com.

01:34:49:02 - 01:34:53:12
Jessie Ott
And what's an, what's an email or what's a good way to get Ahold of you guys?

01:34:53:14 - 01:35:07:01
Thomas Angel
Yeah. The simplest way is hello? At altitude. Bet.com. Okay. That's our, you know, our general email that, you know, we all monitor all of us on the team.

01:35:07:03 - 01:35:10:22
Jessie Ott
Great. So how many, how many people are you now?

01:35:10:23 - 01:35:14:13
Thomas Angel
So we're four full time people. So we're still small, you know? Yeah.

01:35:14:15 - 01:35:16:03
Thomas Angel
That's great.

01:35:16:05 - 01:35:27:06
Thomas Angel
But, yeah, we're slowly growing, with this distributor announcement, we're going to be, adding two new members of the team this year. And then at any given time we've got about.

01:35:27:07 - 01:35:40:10
Jessie Ott
How have you thought or how have you found your, the best way to market your products via, your website? Like what? What has been kind of a game changer for you in that way? In that way?

01:35:40:12 - 01:36:11:12
Thomas Angel
Yeah. I mean, honestly, at this point for us, it's like it's partner marketing, right? So it's doing like, you know, events. It's doing partnerships with me. Some of it's like influencers, affiliate marketing, like especially in this space at our scale. The number one thing for us is, is getting people to try it. Right. This is that trial, especially in a, in a it's a little bit different between the lattes and, and the alcohol alternatives, the lattes.

01:36:11:12 - 01:36:31:08
Thomas Angel
It's definitely, much more like you need to try it, whereas the alcohol attorney is there's enough, like, people interested in this space, right. Like people who are like, I'm looking for things that are not on the haul like that are, you know, either going to give me a feeling or, you know, give me the look of, like, I'm drinking alcohol or the flavor.

01:36:31:10 - 01:36:55:04
Thomas Angel
So a little bit different between those two. But I would say number one is just it's getting out there and partnering with people, whether that's events, whether that's affiliates, whether that's, you know, influencers. You know, because for us right now, like doing like Instagram and Facebook ads, it's so expensive. And to try to chase a return on ad spend that, you know, positive for shipping beverage is always pretty hard.

01:36:55:06 - 01:37:16:00
Thomas Angel
Yeah. You can see that. Yeah. Plus, you know, for us right now, it's like, we're more focused on, you know, getting those retail outlets, kind of getting the critical mass. Because if we go and spend a bunch of money on, you know, trying to get awareness of our product someplace and people don't have a place to go and buy it right away, other than our website.

01:37:16:00 - 01:37:20:03
Thomas Angel
Like, you're kind of, you know, you're wasting dollars a little bit.

01:37:20:05 - 01:37:28:11
Jessie Ott
Yeah, that makes sense. Okay. Well, is there anything else we haven't talked about that you want to know?

01:37:28:11 - 01:37:35:05
Thomas Angel
I mean, I think this is your opportunity to to do it, you know, deep dive. Usually, when we do these things, it's like ten minutes or less.

01:37:35:05 - 01:37:37:11
Thomas Angel
So I know this is like, you.

01:37:37:11 - 01:37:39:21
Jessie Ott
Know, take all the time you need. It's fun.

01:37:40:02 - 01:37:42:13
Thomas Angel
Yeah, yeah. So what is fun?

01:37:42:15 - 01:37:51:01
Jessie Ott
What is one thing that about you that no one typically knows about? Thomas.

01:37:51:03 - 01:37:52:22
Thomas Angel
Ooh. It can.

01:37:52:22 - 01:38:04:22
Jessie Ott
Be simple as a movie or favorite actor or, you know, oh, somewhere you've traveled that's kind of different than everybody else. Or.

01:38:05:00 - 01:38:10:01
Thomas Angel
Yeah, that's. That's hard. That's hard. I mean, I would say.

01:38:10:03 - 01:38:12:13
Thomas Angel
I mean, you don't know what you do. That's cool.

01:38:12:16 - 01:38:18:03
Thomas Angel
How much you know, like. Yeah, I mean, obviously like, you know, not a lot of people know that I'm, you know, Colombian speak Spanish.

01:38:18:03 - 01:38:19:08
Thomas Angel
You know, I didn't know.

01:38:19:12 - 01:38:23:08
Thomas Angel
Them. Also half, you know, American, right? So.

01:38:23:10 - 01:38:23:22
Jessie Ott
You know.

01:38:24:00 - 01:38:25:09
Thomas Angel
American.

01:38:25:11 - 01:38:28:14
Thomas Angel
Yeah. Like that.

01:38:28:16 - 01:38:35:18
Jessie Ott
I'll have people come back in and start speaking. Oh, you really do speak Spanish? I'm like, no, I really don't. That's all I know. Anyway. Go ahead.

01:38:35:23 - 01:38:39:13
Thomas Angel
If you split your time between Florida and Texas by this point, you have to be fluent.

01:38:39:16 - 01:38:40:10
Thomas Angel
One it's.

01:38:40:10 - 01:38:44:03
Jessie Ott
A shame. It's really a shame. You're right.

01:38:44:04 - 01:39:00:17
Thomas Angel
But yeah. No, I mean, I think, you know, I don't know, I'm a pretty open book. I, you know, I usually don't try to, have things where it's like I, you know, keep an ace up my sleeve kind of situation. You know, I think just be authentically you. And, I don't know, I it's a hard question.

01:39:00:18 - 01:39:01:03
Thomas Angel
It's always.

01:39:01:03 - 01:39:01:13
Thomas Angel
One. Okay.

01:39:01:13 - 01:39:07:19
Jessie Ott
I know it is kind of hard. Okay. So how about what's your favorite movie then we'll we'll go new movie.

01:39:07:21 - 01:39:11:11
Thomas Angel
I'm a, I'm a big, What.

01:39:11:13 - 01:39:18:19
Jessie Ott
What series are you watching these days? That's fun.

01:39:18:21 - 01:39:21:10
Thomas Angel
YouTube. Disney. You don't have time. No, no no.

01:39:21:10 - 01:39:39:03
Thomas Angel
No, it's fine, it's fine. This is the funny part now for us because it's like, usually we we put things on to kind of fall asleep. And, we've been watching this series lately on, on Netflix, and I'm trying. I remember the actual name of it. It's like snack, snack. Something like Snack Attack. And it's actually the most fascinating series.

01:39:39:03 - 01:39:51:07
Thomas Angel
It's like get always like really like professional, like chefs, like food scientists. And they have to recreate like, traditional, like, snack foods. So it'll be like Pringles or Twix or.

01:39:51:09 - 01:39:51:23
Thomas Angel
Or you have.

01:39:51:23 - 01:40:09:22
Thomas Angel
Nuggets or whatever it is. And like, they have like an hour and a half and they have to like, you know, make their most like accurate replication, you know, or, you know, recreation of the snack foods. And in the second round, they have to like, create their own invention so as, like a, like a food and bev entrepreneur.

01:40:09:22 - 01:40:32:16
Thomas Angel
It's such a fascinating thing to watch because you want it's about like seeing how difficult it is to mass produce these things that people love. And then the second piece of it is to see the creativity. These people go out and try to, you know, hit on those themes. So like the one that we watch as we're falling asleep last night was about, Kit Kats.

01:40:32:18 - 01:40:48:21
Thomas Angel
So the second challenge was you have to create something that's shareable, you know, like you could share up to, you know, with four people, you know, and, you know, it's just fascinating to see how you know, where they're where they're going to. Right? Do they go sweet? Do they go savory? Do they go, you know, they can use.

01:40:49:03 - 01:40:51:14
Jessie Ott
Whatever ingredients they want.

01:40:51:16 - 01:40:53:08
Thomas Angel
Whatever ingredients they want.

01:40:53:10 - 01:40:53:21
Thomas Angel
That sounds.

01:40:53:21 - 01:40:58:18
Jessie Ott
Fun. Have you seen, is it cake?

01:40:58:20 - 01:40:59:06
Thomas Angel
Yeah.

01:40:59:08 - 01:41:09:03
Jessie Ott
That reminds me of. Is it cake? Is. They have to replicate, like, solo cups. And you don't know if it's really solo cups or cake. That is a sick show. I can't believe they can do all that.

01:41:09:03 - 01:41:10:03
Thomas Angel
It's there, you.

01:41:10:05 - 01:41:10:10
Thomas Angel
Know.

01:41:10:10 - 01:41:11:00
Thomas Angel
It's.

01:41:11:02 - 01:41:33:23
Thomas Angel
Amazing. The same theme is that, Yeah. So if you get a chance to check that out. Yeah. Just like fun things like that. Right. Because it's like, you know, I will admit, like, Shark Tank used to be one of my favorite shows to watch until becoming an entrepreneur. And now anytime I watch Shark Tank, like, it makes me so nervous because, like, I think about myself being in the shoes of an entrepreneur.

01:41:34:01 - 01:41:35:15
Thomas Angel
And I'm like, before, like, you know, when you don't.

01:41:35:19 - 01:41:39:10
Thomas Angel
Give them the money, just give them the money. If they're good people.

01:41:39:12 - 01:41:49:04
Thomas Angel
Oh my God. Yeah. You're just like, oh, like, I feel so bad for these people because feel like I could be in their shoes. And I know exactly.

01:41:49:06 - 01:41:53:01
Jessie Ott
Oh that's funny. I love that I don't watch it anymore. Just don't.

01:41:53:01 - 01:41:57:17
Thomas Angel
Watch. Yeah. Watch. Attack!

01:41:57:19 - 01:41:59:14
Thomas Angel
Stick with the food.

01:41:59:16 - 01:42:01:01
Thomas Angel
Exactly. Lighthearted.

01:42:01:01 - 01:42:20:07
Jessie Ott
Well, this was awesome. I appreciate your time. I'm sure you've got, plenty of things to do while you're up there and family to see, so I won't keep you any longer. But this has been so much fun. Thank you for taking us through your whole journey of life. I've never met anyone or had anyone on the show that did all the cool things you did at Boeing.

01:42:20:07 - 01:42:40:10
Jessie Ott
That is super awesome. I'm so glad you got to experience all that with your wife living abroad and all those things and and that you guys were able to create your own company and, and work together and get the same holidays off. That's great. These are delicious. I wish you the best of luck. If there's anything I can do to help you, please just let me know.

01:42:40:12 - 01:42:42:20
Thomas Angel
Thank you. Jesse, I really appreciate the time.

01:42:42:22 - 01:42:45:01
Jessie Ott
You bet you got it. All right. Bye bye.

01:42:45:06 - 01:42:47:08
Thomas Angel
All right. Bye bye.

01:42:47:10 - 01:42:50:06
Jessie Ott
Produced by Fedora Productions.